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ATF Preparing Operation to Target Smith & Wesson and Others

Interesting and concerning article, a few things I took from reading it.
1st nothing about the NRA? Luckily the GOA is involved.
2nd it seems they “IOI’s” from the ATF may be just looking for documentation errors which is a big deal in fact was the downfall of a minor player in an AR parts manufacturer in Connecticut about 15 years ago, sorry but the name of the company escapes me.
3rd is the current administration’s plan to remove the protection from frivolous lawsuits so that individuals, states and organizations will be allowed to sue gun manufacturers when their products are used by criminals who shouldn’t have access to firearms. This is something, “my opinion” will be difficult as it would open the door to “as mentioned” in the article removing that same protection for thousands of other companies including car/vehicle manufacturer’s.
And finally.
4th the article lost me when again it was mentioned that the right to “keep and bare arms is a GOD given right”
The constitution was written by men and although they were religious they were not gods, they were MEN.

The bottom line is it’s obvious the current administration knowing that it will be difficult to disarm law abiding citizens in one fell swoop is taking the tack of death by a thousand cuts.
 
Keystone19250 said:
Interesting and concerning article, a few things I took from reading it.
1st nothing about the NRA? Luckily the GOA is involved.
2nd it seems they “IOI’s” from the ATF may be just looking for documentation errors which is a big deal in fact was the downfall of a minor player in an AR parts manufacturer in Connecticut about 15 years ago, sorry but the name of the company escapes me.
3rd is the current administration’s plan to remove the protection from frivolous lawsuits so that individuals, states and organizations will be allowed to sue gun manufacturers when their products are used by criminals who shouldn’t have access to firearms. This is something, “my opinion” will be difficult as it would open the door to “as mentioned” in the article removing that same protection for thousands of other companies including car/vehicle manufacturer’s.
And finally.
4th the article lost me when again it was mentioned that the right to “keep and bare arms is a GOD given right”
The constitution was written by men and although they were religious they were not gods, they were MEN.

The bottom line is it’s obvious the current administration knowing that it will be difficult to disarm law abiding citizens in one fell swoop is taking the tack of death by a thousand cuts.
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First, if you read the constitution you will notice that the framers refer to it is natural rights or unalienable rights endowed to us by our creator. The constitution does NOT endow you with rights. You are BORN with those rights. The constitution just keeps the government from infringing on those rights. Our “ Creator” is god to Christians, Allah to Muslims or the natural universe to atheists. So when a Christian says “ God given rights” he is absolutely correct regardless of the existence or lack of existence of a Christian god.

Back to the topic. Why S&W hasn’t moved out of New England altogether I don’t understand. As for the AFT, we already knew the president was going to weaponize them against gun owners. It matters not that gun manufacturers have nothing to do with gun crime.
What perplexes me is that it is almost universally accepted here that politicians use the government and government agencies to circumvent the constitution in restricting our 2A rights. This memo which evidently was not intended for public release clearly shows they intend to use the ATF to harass gun manufacturers for no logical reason other than to diminish their business or shut them down altogether. Numerous threads and conversations here pertain to back handed government interference and infringement of our rights. Politicians lying about statistics and using covert methods to influence public opinion and/or limit or eliminate your right to keep and bear arms. None of you dispute that. How many conversations have we had about Fast and Furious or Operation Choke Point ? Yet somehow suggesting that the government may encourage people to do things that will focus national attention on the “Danger” of AR-15s and legal gun ownership in general results in being called a conspiracy theorist, a “True patriot” and a tin foil hat wearing delusional nut job.
 
Bassbob said:
First, if you read the constitution you will notice that the framers refer to it is natural rights or unalienable rights endowed to us by our creator. The constitution does NOT endow you with rights. You are BORN with those rights. The constitution just keeps the government from infringing on those rights. Our “ Creator” is god to Christians, Allah to Muslims or the natural universe to atheists. So when a Christian says “ God given rights” he is absolutely correct regardless of the existence or lack of existence of a Christian god.

Back to the topic. Why S&W hasn’t moved out of New England altogether I don’t understand. As for the AFT, we already knew the president was going to weaponize them against gun owners. It matters not that gun manufacturers have nothing to do with gun crime.
What perplexes me is that it is almost universally accepted here that politicians use the government and government agencies to circumvent the constitution in restricting our 2A rights. This memo which evidently was not intended for public release clearly shows they intend to use the ATF to harass gun manufacturers for no logical reason other than to diminish their business or shut them down altogether. Numerous threads and conversations here pertain to back handed government interference and infringement of our rights. Politicians lying about statistics and using covert methods to influence public opinion and/or limit or eliminate your right to keep and bear arms. None of you dispute that. How many conversations have we had about Fast and Furious or Operation Choke Point ? Yet somehow suggesting that the government may encourage people to do things that will focus national attention on the “Danger” of AR-15s and legal gun ownership in general results in being called a conspiracy theorist, a “True patriot” and a tin foil hat wearing delusional nut job.
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You have your opinion and I have mine and I stand by mine when it comes to the “God given right” part of our conversation.
Now I’m not advocating what the ATF is doing however it is their responsibility to monitor and investigate possible errors in documentation of errors “mistakes” made in manufacturing where parts such as but not limited to (receivers) that have made it to a specific point in the manufacturing process but is scrapped out due to multiple issues especially if it’s the receiver that has been serialized. I know this first hand because while working for Mossberg I was involved with two such investigations one of which is when the ATF had office space at the assembly plant. It can be called intrusive or anything else you want to label it but it (IS) basically them doing there job.
 
Bassbob said:
Are yuse guys wearing tin foil hats ?
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In case anybody needs one........
 
So the current administration is going to weaponize ATF even more than it has been in the past. I can't believe that the major gun manufacturers would be blind-sided by this information. Like the article stated, those in New England are already in the anti-gun movement's crosshairs. If any of you have an FFL you should have realized that a records inspection is really just a fishing trip. ATF is just going to charter a bigger boat for this trip. Regardless of intent, sloppy record keeping can cost you to lose your license whether you're a manufacturer or dealer. I expect that ATF will have little to show for all their effort because I suspect that these factories know how to run a tight ship. These days you can't stay in business very long if you don't how to play the game.
 
Keystone19250 said:
You have your opinion and I have mine and I stand by mine when it comes to the “God given right” part of our conversation.
Now I’m not advocating what the ATF is doing however it is their responsibility to monitor and investigate possible errors in documentation of errors “mistakes” made in manufacturing where parts such as but not limited to (receivers) that have made it to a specific point in the manufacturing process but is scrapped out due to multiple issues especially if it’s the receiver that has been serialized. I know this first hand because while working for Mossberg I was involved with two such investigations one of which is when the ATF had office space at the assembly plant. It can be called intrusive or anything else you want to label it but it (IS) basically them doing there job.
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I bet those problem receivers whether with a serial number or not didn't end up in the dumpster behind the plant!
 
Recusant said:
I bet those problem receivers whether with a serial number or not didn't end up in the dumpster behind the plant!
Click to expand...
Any receiver whether aluminum or steel that was deemed unusable due to defects in manufacturing or any of the multiple parameters that was setup by the engineers including those serialized was crushed and sent to a recycling company to be chopped up and then eventually melted down. If serialized it had to be documented using pictures of before and after being crushed showing the S# this was verified by a minimum of 3 different employees and signed off by each one. Not one gun part ended up in a dumpster of any kind and anything destroyed was crushed or bent in half “barrels” and recycled by eventually being melting down.
 
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Keystone19250 said:
Any receiver whether aluminum or steel that was deemed unusable due to defects in manufacturing or any of the multiple parameters that was setup by the engineers including those serialized was crushed and sent to a recycling company to be chopped up and then eventually melted down. If serialized it had to be documented using pictures of before and after being crushed showing the S# this was verified by a minimum of 3 different employees and signed off by each one. Not one gun part ended up in a dumpster of any kind and anything destroyed was crushed or bent in half “barrels” and recycled by eventually being melting down.
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That's as I would expect. I would imagine that ALL manufacturers do pretty much the same thing.
 
Keystone19250 said:
You have your opinion and I have mine and I stand by mine when it comes to the “God given right” part of our conversation.
Now I’m not advocating what the ATF is doing however it is their responsibility to monitor and investigate possible errors in documentation of errors “mistakes” made in manufacturing where parts such as but not limited to (receivers) that have made it to a specific point in the manufacturing process but is scrapped out due to multiple issues especially if it’s the receiver that has been serialized. I know this first hand because while working for Mossberg I was involved with two such investigations one of which is when the ATF had office space at the assembly plant. It can be called intrusive or anything else you want to label it but it (IS) basically them doing there job.
Click to expand...
It’s really not an opinion thing brother. It’s right there in the constitution. It doesn’t matter if you like it or believe it or not. It states clearly we are endowed with unalienable rights by our creator, whatever that is. The government does not grant rights. We are born with them. The constitution is a document which limits the government’s ability to usurp those rights.
 
They will continue their witchhunt until it yields fruit. As long as "they" are calling the shots, no one is safe. Certain individuals in power would rather you cower in fear waiting on the 'defunded' police dept (mental health professionals) when something goes bump in the night. Yeah, that's a thing in Chicago now.
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