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Flock cameras at gun ranges

i still don't like it and want all the cameras torn down. plus they make errors so you can be in trouble even if you didn't do anything wrong. plenty of reporting on that. a few days in jail for a computer mistake or mistaken identity is still a few days in jail even if they just let you go and jail is an ugly place. payments and penalties after the screwup dont erase the screwup. no sir, facial recognition and the like need to go. all of it, not just flock. i dont care if it makes it easier for leos. do what old school cops did and do the job the right way. no big brother stuff. more places shold do what san francisco did and ban all the cameras.
 
MN300PRC said:
i still don't like it and want all the cameras torn down. plus they make errors so you can be in trouble even if you didn't do anything wrong. plenty of reporting on that. a few days in jail for a computer mistake or mistaken identity is still a few days in jail even if they just let you go and jail is an ugly place. payments and penalties after the screwup dont erase the screwup. no sir, facial recognition and the like need to go. all of it, not just flock. i dont care if it makes it easier for leos. do what old school cops did and do the job the right way. no big brother stuff. more places shold do what san francisco did and ban all the cameras.
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good luck getting all cameras removed.

they are here to stay...

go live in the woods, off the grid.
 
Retired Bum said:
If you have a Ring camera system, it has been reported that the police are able to access your camera via the cloud, with no permission and no warrant. I am only repeating what I have read, and I am unable to cite the source.
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Officers typically canvas areas where crimes have occurred to get permission from owners of surveillance cameras to access video. If data goes to the cloud I am pretty sure you would need a warrant if the owner doesn't give it up.
 
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Wanna bet?
 
BruceMc said:
My understanding of FLOCK data is the data gathered from a parking lot camera, or a gun shop, is not shared system wide, unless that user chooses to allow it. There is data that the "gubment" can't see. In a lot of places there is a privacy statement associated with the cameras somewhere. If there are cameras at a location you frequent, ask.

I will add that the reality of abuse of the system is very real as there are only rules of FLOCK and it's users to police the system. Of course there are some state statutes that could apply but some are a stretch. The use of FLOCK cameras should be codified in federal statute.

If any part of my understanding of the FLOCK system is not correct please let me know.
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The problem is the state or location doesn't own the camera or data it collects.
Illinois found out the hard way when ICE went to Flock to get data from the cameras to track the illegals and locations Illinois was harboring them.
Flock is just a huge data broker, and that data is worth huge dollars to someone willing to pay for it. Flock also has cameras tech that can harvest cell phone and RFID tag information. This is illegal surveillance in my eyes no two ways about it.
Here's just one instance
Flock Camera Drug Bust in Wisconsin
A high-profile 2026 case in Wisconsin illustrates how Flock Safety’s nationwide network of automated license plate readers (ALPRs) is being used to justify drug-related stops and searches.

The Case
In April 2025, Edward Abrams-Phillips was arrested in Wisconsin after police used Flock cameras to track his vehicle across state lines. His car was flagged at multiple Flock cameras on I‑41 and Bridge Street, crossing into Michigan — a state where recreational marijuana is legal — and returning to Wisconsin Gadget Review.

According to court records reviewed by 404 Media, Brown County deputies ran dozens of queries across thousands of Flock cameras, noting that the vehicle “travels to Michigan frequently” and that Michigan is a “known source state for marijuana” themarijuanaherald.com+1. This travel pattern became the probable cause for a coordinated intercept.

Arrest and Charges
Police pulled Abrams-Phillips over, claimed to detect the odor of raw marijuana inside the vehicle, and searched it, finding cannabis. He was charged with possession. The original domestic violence bail-jumping charge was dismissed, leaving marijuana possession as his only conviction.

The arrest was not based on evidence that he was transporting marijuana into Wisconsin — only on his pattern of travel to a legal marijuana state.

Broader Implications
This case is part of a growing pattern where lawful travel to states where cannabis is legal is being used as a pretext for drug investigations. Civil liberties advocates warn of mission creep: surveillance data collected for traffic enforcement is being repurposed for drug cases, sometimes without direct evidence of illegal activity. Flock describes its ALPRs as recording license plates, vehicle details, locations, and timestamps, helping police identify vehicles and develop leads. But critics argue that when thousands of cameras are connected, a single driver’s movements can be reconstructed across states, creating a de facto surveillance network.
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As you see whether you agree or not these have serious implications that go far and wide.
 
Has anyone viewed the arrest reports or affidavits regarding the case against the guy in Wisconsin. Most news reports seem to be providing only the part they choose to make FLOCK look nefarious. As a retired Leo I see things different like why did the police run his plate into the FLOCK system to begin with. Did they already suspect he was smuggling marijuana or was it due to him having a warrant outstanding for bail jumping on an assault arrest? Remember the news reports said they ran his plate, not that they queried the system for cars frequently crossing the border. In my opinion the police were looking for a bail jumper and came upon a bigger issue. By the way, dismissing a bail jumping charge is pretty common after the guy is reaŕrested and goes to trial. I don't trust the media, they will bend the truth to fit their agenda, especially when they lean to the left.

But as I stated in previous post, there too much room for abuse in the system and it needs to be regulated beyond user agreements.
 
BruceMc said:
Has anyone viewed the arrest reports or affidavits regarding the case against the guy in Wisconsin.
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Doubtful the public ever will.

BruceMc said:
As a retired Leo I see things different like why did the police run his plate into the FLOCK system to begin with.
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Great question!

BruceMc said:
Did they already suspect he was smuggling marijuana or was it due to him having a warrant outstanding for bail jumping on an assault arrest?
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Either way, it smacks of a violation of the 4th.

BruceMc said:
Remember the news reports said they ran his plate, not that they queried the system for cars frequently crossing the border. In my opinion the police were looking for a bail jumper and came upon a bigger issue. By the way, dismissing a bail jumping charge is pretty common after the guy is reaŕrested and goes to trial. I don't trust the media, they will bend the truth to fit their agenda, especially when they lean to the left.

But as I stated in previous post, there too much room for abuse in the system and it needs to be regulated beyond user agreements.
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And that's why, even as a former prosecutor and currently practicing criminal defense lawyer, in general, I distrust law enforcement today. It wasn't like this twenty years ago.
 
Now Sir, as an attorney you should know that " smacks of" and "is" are not even close. SCOTUS put the good house keeping seal on pretext stops years ago.
 
I look at it this way. Most of us on here disagree with the pretext of these cameras. We're not fighting them for today per say, we're fighting them for our grandkids forward. Just imagine what our country would look like today if the early pioneers would not fought back against the tax put on us from Great Britain. We as a country would be far different than we are today. I don't want the country to be that far different going forward to where we've turned into East Germany or worse North Korea.
We have to stay vigilant.
 
I don't know there's a solution to this problem. The courts are currently ruling that the data from FLOCK cameras are searchable and don't require a warrant because they are public record. The recent geofence ruling could possibly be applied to the scanners with the FLOCK cameras that read electronic signals from your car but that would only require the police to get a warrant not that it's illegal to collect the information. But these are just the tip of the iceberg. Every facet of our lives are documented and catalogued by so many different processes and all that information is available by the government with a search warrant should they "determine" they need to know.
 
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