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Gun Safes

ddeuce22

ddeuce22

Professional
I've been putting this off for awhile now, but me and my g/f closed on a house yesterday so now that I
1. Have the space, and
2. Will have people coming from all over to visit us since we can put them up, Have the need for one.

I do not have nearly as many firearms as alot of you guys here, so I do not need a giant safe. One to fit maybe 3-5 long guns and a few handguns / ammo / important documents should suffice.

I've dealt with alot of safe companies / manufacturers in the past as I used to run a locksmith & door company back in NYC, but I am curious as to what you guys use, who you prefer, and so on. Lay it on me fellas. As always, much appreciated.
 
Huge chunk of a cost of a gun safe is the shipping. So the best deal is going to be what you can find local to you.

I recently bought a Vital Impact from Sportsman's Warehouse for my mom, and I was impressed by what you get for $300. IME, they're heavier, and nicer built than the Harbor Freight ones going for the same price. They don't allow you to buy it in store for some reason. You have to order online, and pickup in person. They did load it onto my truck for me.

I bought 2 stack-on safes for myself, a 24 gun, and an 18 gun. But the reason I went with them was because they have a warehouse local to me, so I got them way under MSRP picking it up in person. I think the company's gone Chapter 11 though.

I was looking at Liberty Safes, if you've got a Cabelas/Bass pro local, they carry a line of rebranded Liberty safes that cost less than comparable Liberty models, branded ProVault. I was going to get one of these, until I found out about Stack-On being local, and being able to purchase 2 stack-on safes for the price of 1 ProVault.

Another one I was considering was the Winchester branded ones at Tractor Supply Co. At the time the only Tractor supply Co by me was still under construction, and the closest operational one was a 6 hour round trip.

Buy a larger safe than you need. I've filled both mine up already, and am already trying to find space for a 3rd safe.
 
ddeuce22 said:
I've been putting this off for awhile now, but me and my g/f closed on a house yesterday so now that I
1. Have the space, and
2. Will have people coming from all over to visit us since we can put them up, Have the need for one.

I do not have nearly as many firearms as alot of you guys here, so I do not need a giant safe. One to fit maybe 3-5 long guns and a few handguns / ammo / important documents should suffice.

I've dealt with alot of safe companies / manufacturers in the past as I used to run a locksmith & door company back in NYC, but I am curious as to what you guys use, who you prefer, and so on. Lay it on me fellas. As always, much appreciated.
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Annihilator said:
I like Liberty Safes, also I think now Hornady has bigger safes now, you might want to check them out.
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I'm with Annihilator on this 1. I like the locking and operating system as compared to my Browning mechanical. I bought semi local(100 miles) from me and saved shipping on the Browning. The Liberty didn't cost me anything on shipping though. There is a safe I've been looking at that you out together and makes moving a whole lot better/easier. I'm not sure of the name but a search could turn it up? Liberty is very smooth, but fairly large and weighs almost 1k I think, but that could've been shipping weight? I could've bought it from Brownell's? Buying close could be helpful by looking at in stock and see what catches you eye. I browsed for almost a year before I bought the 1st 1.
 
bigx5murf said:
Huge chunk of a cost of a gun safe is the shipping. So the best deal is going to be what you can find local to you.

I recently bought a Vital Impact from Sportsman's Warehouse for my mom, and I was impressed by what you get for $300. IME, they're heavier, and nicer built than the Harbor Freight ones going for the same price. They don't allow you to buy it in store for some reason. You have to order online, and pickup in person. They did load it onto my truck for me.

I bought 2 stack-on safes for myself, a 24 gun, and an 18 gun. But the reason I went with them was because they have a warehouse local to me, so I got them way under MSRP picking it up in person. I think the company's gone Chapter 11 though.

I was looking at Liberty Safes, if you've got a Cabelas/Bass pro local, they carry a line of rebranded Liberty safes that cost less than comparable Liberty models, branded ProVault. I was going to get one of these, until I found out about Stack-On being local, and being able to purchase 2 stack-on safes for the price of 1 ProVault.

Another one I was considering was the Winchester branded ones at Tractor Supply Co. At the time the only Tractor supply Co by me was still under construction, and the closest operational one was a 6 hour round trip.

Buy a larger safe than you need. I've filled both mine up already, and am already trying to find space for a 3rd safe.
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Ps. A larger safe that you need at the time can be detrimental to you wallet😁!
 
ddeuce22 said:
I've been putting this off for awhile now, but me and my g/f closed on a house yesterday so now that I
1. Have the space, and
2. Will have people coming from all over to visit us since we can put them up, Have the need for one.

I do not have nearly as many firearms as alot of you guys here, so I do not need a giant safe. One to fit maybe 3-5 long guns and a few handguns / ammo / important documents should suffice.

I've dealt with alot of safe companies / manufacturers in the past as I used to run a locksmith & door company back in NYC, but I am curious as to what you guys use, who you prefer, and so on. Lay it on me fellas. As always, much appreciated.
Click to expand...
If you are like a lot of enthusiasts, you should plan for growth. And I wound up having another safe just for 20K rounds of various calibre ammo.
 
What is your budget? Never buy a safe that costs more than whatever you are putting in it.

What other factors are involved in your security plan? Is the safe going to be out in plain view? Do you live in a high crime area ? Are there always strangers in your house?

You can get a "21 gun" ( it will not actually hold 21 guns unless all of them are pistols) Winchester safe that's pretty stout for around $500. It weighs about 400 lbs empty, but like most "Consumer grade" safes it is largely 16 gauge sheet metal with insulation in between the panels. It has pretty good fire and water ratings and is stout enough to stop an average idiot burglar. It has four 1" bolts that lock the door, so not your average $200 Stack On. A guy with a circular saw and a half an hour where no one can hear him running a saw or see his getaway car outside can get in it from the top, so as far as being a "Heavy duty" safe, it really isn't. I have one, but it is pretty well hidden and my situation is such that you aren't going to ever have much time in my house without someone knowing you are there. It's not my only safe, but it is about the bare minimum I would personally accept as a safe personally and if my situation was different I likely wouldn't.

Safes are really a budget thing. You should spend as much as you can afford as it relates to the value of what you are putting in it. And you should get a bigger safe than you think you need otherwise you end up like me with multiple safes.
 
Wow lots of responses here!!

MY biggest concern was shipping and moving the goddamn thing. I do plan on adding a few more over the next few years, but I also suspect we won't be in this house for longer than 5 years so I don't want to get stuck trying to move some 1000lb monstrosity. It's a single floor home so It will be sitting on a slab.

I don't have any plans just yet or an idea of where it is going as we do not have the house set up yet so things will change in terms of where everything is going. The secondhand idea is probably right up my alley, i'm always looking for a deal and I don't care if the safe is brand new or not, but secondhand typically means moving it yourself which does pose a problem.

Ahhh so many variables to consider. I truly appreciate all your input gentleman. I have some homework to do.
 
ddeuce22 said:
Wow lots of responses here!!

MY biggest concern was shipping and moving the goddamn thing. I do plan on adding a few more over the next few years, but I also suspect we won't be in this house for longer than 5 years so I don't want to get stuck trying to move some 1000lb monstrosity. It's a single floor home so It will be sitting on a slab.

I don't have any plans just yet or an idea of where it is going as we do not have the house set up yet so things will change in terms of where everything is going. The secondhand idea is probably right up my alley, i'm always looking for a deal and I don't care if the safe is brand new or not, but secondhand typically means moving it yourself which does pose a problem.

Ahhh so many variables to consider. I truly appreciate all your input gentleman. I have some homework to do.
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For perspective, that safe I described earlier which was either 400 or 450 lbs empty, was set in my truck with a forklift and my brother in law and I carried it into my house. I know the guy that moves safes for my LGS and he has a very awesome and expensive safe moving dealie. it will climb stairs. He charges $150 to transport and set a safe up within a 50 mile radius.
 
The only question I'd want answered: What happens if at some point the locking mechanism fails and I'm unable to get it open? Over the years I've read horror stories on other gun boards by members who have had this happen. Has any one here had this happen or know of someone who did.
 
Recusant said:
The only question I'd want answered: What happens if at some point the locking mechanism fails and I'm unable to get it open? Over the years I've read horror stories on other gun boards by members who have had this happen. Has any one here had this happen or know of someone who did.
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I had a small Liberty safe that the electronic lock was failing, I called Liberty up and they gave me a local locksmith to use. When the locksmith came I asked him how would they get into the safe if the lock failed, he said there is a way for them to get into the safe, but he couldn’t indulge on how, which I fully understood.
 
Recusant said:
The only question I'd want answered: What happens if at some point the locking mechanism fails and I'm unable to get it open? Over the years I've read horror stories on other gun boards by members who have had this happen. Has any one here had this happen or know of someone who did.
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All depends on the type of safe, and the type of locking mechanism.
Safe locks work in 2-3 stages typically.

The first and most common issues occur with the Keypad or Dial, depending on if you go with electronic or mechanical.
Both have their pros and cons.

90% of the time its something simple like the battery in the keypad died, or is too weak to provide enough power to release the swingbolt in the lock body that is mounted on the inside of the door. To which you would just take the keypad off of the door and replace the battery.

When you punch the code, the swing bolt in the lock body is allowed to be depressed into the lock body, thus allowing the boltwork inside the door to be operated by the handle on the door and retract the locking bars that slide from the door into the frame.

Keypads can sometimes fail, but its not commonplace, and people who constantly change their safe codes can forget the new code, or mess up the programming when doing so and sometimes render both new and old code useless.

Typically most modern and named brand keypad/lock companies (Big names are Sargent & Greenleaf, AmSec (American Security) Lagard, and some others) All have factory reset abilities programmed into their software.

Dial safes are an entirely different animal and if one of those fail, more than likely you will need a locksmith or Safe technician to come with drill points, drill the mechanism to open the door, then replace it and repair the drill points in the safe. Any well trained and certified safe technician should have the proper tools, materials, and access to the drill points to perform this type of service. However it will not be cheap.

So that covers the keypad/dial and some of the more common mechanisms.

Actual safe redundancies get a bit crazier. Most quality safes have a trauma threshold to where if the safe is attacked with a certain amount of force, it would trigger a relocker which are thick bars that will need to be drilled through before the door could be opened again. These are also triggered by drilling and/or flame lancing attacks.

I won't bore you too much but safes can get a bit crazy. If you ever have any issues or even questions, feel free to Private Message me and i'd be more than happy to help.
 
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With the advent of lithium powered cutting tools, safes are seemingly more and more obsolete. If it were me ( in todays market), I would elect for a steel gun locker/cabinet and not a safe. I have never been one to have much faith in the suggested "fire protection" rating of most safes. To me, a safe is simply an oven no matter what you line it with. I just dont see anything surviving a 2000 degree house fire.
 
A safe, just like anything else, isn't made with the thought to be completely impenetrable. It's supposed to be a deterrent, and an obstacle to buy enough time until someone or something can intervene.

As for fire ratings, again it doesn't make the safe impervious to a fire. It prevents the things inside from heating up to a point they would be set on fire or otherwise lost/damaged, up to a certain degree, for a certain amount of time. More than likely the safe is going to be toast, but your valuables inside may be protected.

Your point of view is one of the most common misunderstandings that people have when it comes to physical security.

Give anyone with experience and knowledge and the right tools, and the proper amount of time and you can gain access to whatever it is you are trying to gain access to. It's about how long will it take, that matters.

IF you have a quality safe, and you call in a certified safe tehcnician and he needs to drill open a safe or cut it, it's still going to take him time. More than enough time for someone who may be trying to gain access to it illegitimately, to struggle with it and have someone like yourself or an LEO arrive on the scene. If that happens, then the safe has done it's job.

Lesser experienced or non experienced, and ill or non equipped will be almost completely deterred typically.
 
ddeuce22 said:
A safe, just like anything else, isn't made with the thought to be completely impenetrable. It's supposed to be a deterrent, and an obstacle to buy enough time until someone or something can intervene.
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sure.. and [if] they are no longer "substantially" more secure than a cheaper/lighter cabinet due to readily available and ultra portable cutting tools.. its probably time to adjust the way we have been thinking. I have bought a few safes in my day and I have moved a few from house to house. I can tell you that I will never buy another safe. If the need should arise that I need more secure storage than I already have, I will get a modular locker. Why.. because a person who is not prepared to defeat a well constructed security locker will have a good bit of trouble getting into it. A person who does come ready can easily get into a locker or a common gunsafe. To me, a cabinet is much more practical so long as it is a well constructed unit. I have had family members who were willed a gunsafe and contents and ultimately have to cut it open. I was amazed at how easy they got into it. A modular locker may not be the answer for everyone and safes will likely always be part of the landscape. That said, the world is changing.
 
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Recusant said:
The only question I'd want answered: What happens if at some point the locking mechanism fails and I'm unable to get it open? Over the years I've read horror stories on other gun boards by members who have had this happen. Has any one here had this happen or know of someone who did.
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You can upgrade the security of your safe by changing the lock and have a backup key to get you in if something fails.

mbausa.com

OMEGA REDUNDANT SWINGBOLT KEY LOCK PACKAGE W/ CHROME KEYPAD

MBA USA, Inc. is a provider of locks, tools and training for locksmiths and security professionals.
mbausa.com mbausa.com
 
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