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"GET OFF Me" blade

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PieterCoetzee

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A few years ago, (Im sorry I dont recall the specific details), a 50ish man was attacked in the parking lot of a WalMart(?), by two younger guys who looked like they spent more time in the gym then behind text books. They claimed they attacked him because they saw a pistol on his belt and were afraid he was going to hurt someone.

OK a couple things. First the guy was a legal CCW carrier. Second he made the mistake of letting the gun be seen. I think he pulled out the holster to put it on when he got out of the car(?). Third there was apparently NO other indication that he was intending to cause any harm other than strapping on the gun.

So the guy wasnt the most tactically aware; but still no criminal intent, just unaware of his surroundings. The two steroid heroes claimed they "had to act to save all the shoppers". They had this guy on the ground like he was a tackling dummy. They werent beating him just holding him until help came.

Well F THAT. The gun guy was maybe 50 or possible 60 years old and "our heroes" 20 to 30. It didnt take two of them and it didnt require them to tackle him.

All this had me thinking then and each time I remember it what I could have used to get them off of me. The giant Rambo knives would be useless in the scrum. There was no way to deploy a folder or even an automatic blade. Only a short fixed blade would do and Im not sure just any fixed blade would work. Of course it would have to be reachable and thats a question in itself

Of course the best solution was not to have been there OR not wait till outside the car to put the gun on OR to check the surroundings. My personal favorite would be to live in a place where when guys see you with a gun they smile and ask what are you carrying today...

What would YOU choose as a "Get the F Off me" tool?




If you guys are interested tell me your suggestions and I give you mine but I dont want to prejudice you with my solution just yet
 
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Ok this has gone through a few transitions. First I decided it MUST be a fixed blade and it MUST be small enough to used in a clench and it MUST be sharp and it MUST be able to stab through heavy clothing. Theres a lot of MUSTs there and that makes the blade pretty specialized limiting to this task.

My first thought was/is a scratch awl or short ice pick. A small round (although round isnt a requirement) designed to pierce not cut. Remember its the point that kills. An Ice Pick will stab through heavy clothing including leather and in this case, it uses the attackers weight as the force. If your history lessons take you back to the days of armor, round piercing blades were designed to defeat chain mail, the kevlar of the period. This design popped up again in the trenches of WW1 and again in bayonets used by the Soviets, Chinese and the British Enfield. I found a few Awl/Ice Pick options but could never find a good way to carry it. Awls and Ice picks are cheap so I keep looking.

I toyed with a few Neck Knives but ruled them out because of access when tackled. I suspect that there may be a work around for this but I wasnt comfortable with any solution I could find. I think it has to be something you can wear on your center line, just off one side of your zipper/ belt buckle.

I found the Shivworks Clinch Pick. The edge of the blade is on the top (flat side). Its a pretty pointy blade and seems to pierce heavy clothing. The Clinch Pick solved my carry issue with a nice kydex sheathe and adjustable belt strap. The Shivworks knife even has a trainer version; but Im not sure this kind of fighting requires a lot of training-only motivation.
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A similar knife is the Gang Unit it was about half the price of the Shiveworks, a little less svelte but built like a Russian tank. Sadly the company is out of business and I doubt youll find one for sale. Again the blade edge is on the long straight side and the point is pointy enough to pierce even the thickest leather jacket
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I considered a Push Dagger but never found one with a spike, although Im sure there must be one. The issue is that the blade has to be short enough to access and maneuver when tackled. A friend suggested a corkscrew but the old how to carry it issue came up

One of my favorites is the AG Russell STING. Russell is also out of business but CRKT made/makes a nice authorized copy. AG Russell made several versions with different handle materials; but my favoite was/is the Black Chrome. The CRKT version is only available in black but Im not sure its chrome. The AG Russells came with a leather belt clip sheathe. CRKT sorta missed the concept and comes with a sheathe designed to be strapped around the ankle. It can be worn horizontally on a belt as an option. Thankfully there are aftermarket leather sheathes that seem designed for it. I like the Sting. The 3 inch double edge spear point "works" for this role and seems more useful in other fighting requirements; although Im not sure it works BEST for this small particular role. The question of where to wear it is a little more of an issue for THIS role. Its typically something I wear in a 4 or 5 (7 or 8) o'clock position which could make accessing it problematic in a tackle situation.

CRKT copies run sub $100 while original AG Russell's can exceed $300 depending on condition and handle materials.
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(CRKT on right / ORIGINAL AG RUSSELL on left)

Nothing is perfect except not being there. Chances are youll never need it; but I never want to be that guy

anyway that continues to be one of the paths along my journey
 

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CRKT S.P.E.W.
Honestly anything is tuff to get into play rolling on the ground with an attacker. I once went through a training class where we had one of those blue simulated pistols. Even carrying appendix it was very hard to get to and use. Eye opener for sure. Small revolvers work much better to shove into your attacker to get a shot off. Most pistols folks try that and most will push hard enough to move it slide out of battery and you're stuck with a fancy rock.
 
Pitdogg2 said:
Small revolvers work
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Yes I agree You arent wrong. Ive been thinking knife or pokey thing because they are thinner. Ultimately everything will depend on getting access to whatever you choose, so it cant be to deeply concealed; thats why I like center line carry buy Im still open to options

Honestly any long spikey thing could work. Im remembering Drill Sergeants used to carry a M16 firing pin wedged in their pistol belt. They used it as a tool to find carbon in the nicks and cranies of the rifle you thought was clean. If I could figure how to carry a long enough nail that could work. I figure you need at least 2 1/2 inches of penetration to convince someone to "Get Off"
 
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35 or so years ago, I used to carry a push dagger in a sheath in the small of my back. This was long before I had a ccw and carried a firearm for security. I lived in far worse areas back then as a single man than I do these days. While I know it would have been useless in a knife fight like "West Side Story", in a more than likely "grappling" event, I think it would have worked. I still have it somewhere around here, I may start carrying it again after all these years.
 
keep in mind that at ranges that close anything you pull out to try and stick him with he can take away from you and stick you with. In my opinion you are better off trying to find a way to put some distance between you and him and then shoot the SOB. I tend to agree that fingernails, fingers, teeth, etc. are good for that purpose.
 
I have one of these little pokey gougey things that I bought back when all the Russian-Ukraine stuff started up. I bought 3 different knives from them at the time just because I hate commies. I've never carried it but you got me thinking.

bbknives.com

NEEDLE Tactical Knife - Blade Brothers Knives

Tactical concealed carry dagger NEEDLE by BBKnives. Full tang, Fixed blade, stainless steel 1.4116(X50CrMoV15), hardness 57 HRC, 5mm, ABS-plastic sheath.
bbknives.com bbknives.com
 
For work blades I carried a Gerber Fairborn folder in the front right pocket and one of the Kabar TDI knives behind my double mag pouch on the left beltline.
kabar knife.jpg



Since retirement I'm carrying the Scallywag Tactical MDV as shown below. The MDV has the advantage of a "horn" on the kydex sheath that makes it quite easy to pocket carry and draw one handed as the sheath "horn" hooks on the upper edge of the pocket. I've carried this for a couple years and have never had it slide out of the pocket on its own. I do have some gaffer tape on the handle to give an index point and several more of the "rubber bands" on the sheath for added friction to help keep it from coming out of the pocket.

Keep in mind that many people are not going to feel stab or cut wounds right away -especially the stoned or psychotic. Going for tendons on limbs may give the biggest benefit with the least damage and people seeing their arms or wrists bleeding are more likely to back off than someone with a puncture to the abdomen.

skallywag in sheath.jpg
skallywag out.jpg
 
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This is my "Sunday going to church" wear. It is so regular to me I guess I didn't think of it when I responded earlier. I wear the pistol on my strong side (right) obviously and the blade horizontally in a cross-draw on my belt on the left. Neither are visible under my jacket.

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SCraig said:
at ranges that close anything you pull out to try and stick him with he can take away from you
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You are correct. My thinking, and it may be too focused, was for something in a clench, especially a tackle to get him/them off AND then have enough freedom of movement to go to guns if necessary. Thats why Im talking something short and able to pierce heavy clothing
 
PieterCoetzee said:
Yes I agree You arent wrong. Ive been thinking knife or pokey thing because they are thinner. Ultimately everything will depend on getting access to whatever you choose, so it cant be to deeply concealed; thats why I like center line carry buy Im still open to options

Honestly any long spikey thing could work. Im remembering Drill Sergeants used to carry a M16 firing pin wedged in their pistol belt. They used it as a tool to find carbon in the nicks and cranies of the rifle you thought was clean. If I could figure how to carry a long enough nail that could work. I figure you need at least 2 1/2 inches of penetration to convince someone to "Get Off"
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Even thought it’s 119 years old the concept is still relevant. Streets today are like yesterday’s trenches. I know it’s too large for carry, but a smaller version might catch on.
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