testtest

Is a .22LR round plausible for self defense?

So:

Placing a .22 on the X is definitely no harder than placing a 9mm or .45 on the X; in fact, when it comes to subsequent shots, it’s going to be a lot easier due to low recoil.


Here's where we have to be clear in setting the Parameters.

IF the controlling factor is the .22LR ctg, the delivery system is optimized as a 4in to 6in hunting/ field / target handgun . ( Not that far fetched , as the somewhat legitimate reasons to use a .22 include severe arthritis, or other substantial handicap , and near zero recoil is needed .)

Go with it's strengths- good accuracy to lead to precise shot placement. Say , the eye socket, or the ear canal .

If in a mini revolver , or micro pistol , you've got the worst of both worlds - minimal power , yet too small for decent pistol whipping .
 
Here's where we have to be clear in setting the Parameters.

IF the controlling factor is the .22LR ctg, the delivery system is optimized as a 4in to 6in hunting/ field / target handgun . ( Not that far fetched , as the somewhat legitimate reasons to use a .22 include severe arthritis, or other substantial handicap , and near zero recoil is needed .)

Go with it's strengths- good accuracy to lead to precise shot placement. Say , the eye socket, or the ear canal .

If in a mini revolver , or micro pistol , you've got the worst of both worlds - minimal power , yet too small for decent pistol whipping .
IMG_3270.jpeg


The one on the right is a S&W 43C, 8-shot .22LR. Carries nicely in the pocket, and is very controllable & accurate.

4-6” “field pistols” are not required.
 
Well I don't know about any poll, but the guy who told me, well, let's just say he didn't tell me what he did, someone else did. I'm pretty sure he was speaking of his own personal preference.
I had quite a bit of interaction with three men that killed people for $, or at least that was what they were convicted for. All three more than one. You meet the finest people in prison. ;) Somehow that conversation never came up, maybe I take "curiosity killed the cat" too seriously. :LOL:
TALES FROM THE BIG HOUSE:
Had to take one of these three to the hospital. Nurse comes in, very rude to us officers, demanding this that and the other and getting livid when what she wanted went against our policy and was told no. Start talking to the I/M "What do you do honey". I/M: " I kill people". Nurse: "No what did you do for work? I/M: "I just told you I kill people like you." She ran out of the room like her A** was on fire. The I/M look right at me and said "How dare that B**** treat you guys like that? You're just doing your job" YUP, sometimes you meet the funniest if not the finest people in prison.
 
Well, I have been told that the weapons of choice for professional hitmen are .22 at any distance and an ice pick up close.
I was going to see if it would be an authorized side gig, but I would stay in the Double A, minors. The pay isn't as good, but the quality expectation would be right up my alley.

It was going to be the "Good Enough Whack Job Company." When you don't need good, just good enough. Because dead is dead. Call us.

I had a business plan and everything. Chief wouldn't approve it. So sad.:cry:

1749523887820.png
 
View attachment 85385

The one on the right is a S&W 43C, 8-shot .22LR. Carries nicely in the pocket, and is very controllable & accurate.

4-6” “field pistols” are not required.
( If using gun size as the parameter) And that 43C could just as easily be a 432 , still low recoil , and far more effective . ( .32 S&W Long if absolute minimum recoil needed for the Arthyritic or handicapped .)
 
( If using gun size as the parameter) And that 43C could just as easily be a 432 , still low recoil , and far more effective . ( .32 S&W Long if absolute minimum recoil needed for the Arthyritic or handicapped .)
I’ve got a 632UC. It’ll probably replace the 51C .22WMR as a common carry…it’s a lot less recoil, with much faster follow-ups (verified by timer) than a 442. The 43C (and 51C) are even faster…and multiple fast hits tend to trump caliber (see the Ellifritz study).

But I have no qualms carrying the 43C; and I’ve yet to have anyone who poo-poohs a .22’s effectiveness to volunteer to catch one to prove their point.
 
( If using gun size as the parameter) And that 43C could just as easily be a 432 , still low recoil , and far more effective . ( .32 S&W Long if absolute minimum recoil needed for the Arthyritic or handicapped .)
As I said above, .32 Long, and even Short, did in a lot of people in the pre 80s, especially in the South End.
 
But I have no qualms carrying the 43C; and I’ve yet to have anyone who poo-poohs a .22’s effectiveness to volunteer to catch one to prove their point.


I don't voluntarily let people shoot me with BB Guns either , but that doesn't make them effective defensive tools either . Sigh , l recognize the cliche back & forth that l've been bypassing the thread for a while .

Repeating myself , from other discusions , and possibly earlier in this one, ( not necessarily in order ) :

Advantages of .22LR :

1. Low Recoil , rounds off to zero
2. Shooter Friendly . ( Potentially ) Can translate into Precise shot placement , ( Possibly ) in conjunction with reasonably rapid multiple precise hits .

With the right firearm , and sufficient Skill of Arms of the user , of course .

3. Low Cost of Ammo . ( A few years ago used to consider rounded off to zero , but even today very inexpensive compared to other options .)

The cliche is this allows for near unlimited ammounts of practice to hone one's skills . Still true , if you can step out your back door and shoot . In the modern era , for most people , when going shooting involves driving to a Range , waiting to rent a lane , etc , the cost of .22LR is only incremental savings .


There , l'm being fair to point out the positives . But l'm also being USA centric , and ignoring other parts of the World where .22LR is more accessible to regular citizens than centerfires .

*******************

There is the statement / Philosophy along the lines of " Good shot placement is most important , and * what * you use ( either caliber or specific loading ) Doesn't Matter ( or alternatively doesn't matter enough to be concerned with ) . "

There is indeed a lot of meat in that statement ! BUT to me , and l put forth generally , that statement should include an important Caveat .

* So long as the gun & ammunition is at least somewhat suitable for Intended Purposes . *

On any Fora , or any gathering of more than one gun person , it is inevitable to debate What's the best load for XYZ , most often these days for 9mm . Any of the top half dozen or so loads , the differences are trivial in specific subfactors . Add in another 10 or 20 somewhat suitable options , and all are still * More than Plenty Adaquate " .

Likewise .38 Spl vs 9mm vs .40 vs 10mm vs .45 vs ( another 10 choices of lesser popularity , but still good options ) . The answer is always " whichever specific gun that You can shoot with with Reasonably Adaquate Precision , and Reasonably Adaquate Control ( aka rapidity ) . But always with the cavaet of Somewhat Suitable for Intended Purpose .

Where's the dividing line between " Reasonably Suitable " vs " Kinda Marginal , but still better than sharp stick and harsh words " ? Always discussed , but inherently unresolvable .

.380 acp ? .32 H&R Mag ? .32acp ? ( Insert Here ) ? I dunno . I have my opinions & prejudices , but you ( collectively ) make your own Big Boy and Big Girl decision after your own thought process .

*********************

Does .22LR have the ( insert preferred terminology for " getting it done , on the Terminal end " ) , sufficient to be in the category of Kinda Marginal , but better than a sharp stick , or impact weapon , or harsh words ?

Sure Does ! ..... From a Rifle . ( Or a .22 WMR from 4 inch plus Bbl . I've chrono'ed a bunch of things , and .22 WMR from mini / micro guns all fall short of .22LR from a 4 inch .)

But the .22LR from 16 in ( or equivalent ) is to my satisfaction ( and l can make medium convincing defense of my point ) is in same ballpark as ( popular pocket pistol caliber ) using ( ammunition popular for use thereof ) .

**********************

But What If ........

A NSMF who isn't willing to gain a modicum of proficiency with " regular " defensive -ish handguns ?

Cynically , Darwinism in action . But yeah , sometimes they're someone you care about , and somewhat futily you want to give them some sort of option .

Old & Decrepit ?

People who were competent shooters in their prime , often retain surprising skill , for a couple of rounds at least . 80 y.o. Grandma with no previous experience , but the old neighborhood they won't leave has turned bad ? That's challenging , and you'll have to try them with a variety of options .

Actually Disabled ? Again , challenging , try a variety of option , and .22LR might be one of them .

**********************

For Me ?

I've been known to check out things on the back of the Biggfoot Estate with .22 Rifle discretely along my leg . ( More long range potential from shoulder using the sights than a pocket pistol ) .

Going Squirrel Hunting , but wanting mugging defense ( not entirely a joke ) ? Been known to only have .22 rimfire handgun . But then , they are 5 to 6.5 inch Bbl , capable of Squirrel Precision . So confident for CNS shots of human malfactors instead of COM .

********************

Dang , l've written a book length post again .

Pretty much covered all there is to reasonably say on the topic , so l'll try to ignore the " .22LR as Defensive " topic for a year or two now .
 
Back
Top