Air marshals use subsonic rounds that in the average case shouldn't fully penetrate the fuselage of an airliner at 30K+ feet, which could cause sudden decompression and would likely kill several passengers in the process. Not sure I would really want to have to remember to reload before the flight with "airliner safe" rounds to avoid turning my 737 into a giant flute.
Is Constitutional Carry a Mistake?
- Thread starter Mike H.
- Start date
HansGruber
Ronin
Bassbob
Emissary
Personally I am extremely not in favor of ever being on an airplane again period.
I know quite a few John Q Citizens I would feel better about being armed in my airplane than the average fed though. Not that I know all that many feds, but I know a few.
Anchorite
Operator
The *only* person I trust with a firearm is me.
I don’t have my pilots license but I do have to fly from time to time, so there’s that.
Bassbob
Emissary
Well in an ideal world. Sometimes you need to have faith and trust in a team member.
The Night Rider
Professional
Just like the state I live in. No permit required. Also no class/training. You can still get a permit or a enhanced. Most people get basic and it's for traveling. As far as training goes, if you're not familiar with that particular firearm you probably have no business carrying it. As far as owning and carrying I'm sure just because you have a driver's license doesn't me you should be behind the wheel. Slippery slope. Opinion.
Bassbob
Emissary
No, there has not. Now before anyone here gets their nose out of joint, I'm not talking about this thread or anyone in it necessarily, but it's mostly just guys virtue signaling or trying to intimate how well trained they think they are without having to sound like a jerk by coming out and saying how well trained they think they are.
The amount of training one needs to safely carry a gun is actually surprisingly not much. Basic gun safety rules. Know the law. Rudimentary marksmanship skills. That's it. I'm not saying that's all it takes to be able to effectively carry a firearm for use in defense of yourself or others, just that's all it takes to do it without becoming a danger to others. All the outrage about untrained people running around with guns is ridiculous. Especially when you consider the sheer number of thugs and criminals with guns who don't give a F what anyone in the "Gun community" thinks about anything.
Do I think people should train if they are going to regularly carry a gun ? Yes, if you want to do it effectively. Do I care if "YOU" do or not ? Not at all.
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Anchorite
Operator
Not in the “civilian“ world we live in today. No thanks.
Way too many folks running around with guns and apparently have zero familiarity, training or respect for their weapon of choice from what I’ve observed. YMMV, of course.
Bassbob
Emissary
Again, have you seen evidence of it actually being a problem ? I assume you see the F'ing morons who drive cars around you daily. That is a way bigger issue.
And for clarity, I am surely not saying to trust anyone you don't know and/haven't trained with.
HansGruber
Ronin
I will say I’ve seen a lot more people doing stupid things with guns at ranges than I did, say, 10-15 years ago. I’ve definitely been muzzle flagged more the last times that I went to a “public” ranges than ever…
I don’t go to those ranges anymore.
Bassbob
Emissary
I quit going to public ranges about 30 years ago.
HayesGreener
Ronin
Daily Range management is an intense undertaking that requires constant vigilance and supervision by competent range safety officers. Unfortunately most public ranges are not able or are unwilling to provide that level if supervision. I conducted a lot of courses on my range and was astounded by the lack of knowledge and discipline among folks who had been shooting at public ranges. There is a big difference between stupid and ignorance. I can correct ignorance, can't fix stupid. A lot of folks just need someone to take the time to teach them proper safety protocols. Stupid just gets you sent home.
Bassbob
Emissary
It’s strange that in all the years I’ve be belonged to my gun club and all the times I’ve been on the range with other people I didn’t know I have never seen anyone do anything stupid there. And it is 100% unmanned as far as RSO goes.
HayesGreener
Ronin
You are fortunate to be idiot free
The Night Rider
Professional
I've said this before a bunch of times but I honestly believe that all you really need to safely carry a handgun or long gun or an M105 howitzer is the four rules.
1. Treat all handguns as loaded at all times.
2. Never point a gun at anything you're not willing to shoot.
3. Always be aware of your Target and what's beyond it.
4. Never put your finger on the trigger until your sights are on the target and you've made a decision to shoot.
I might add one more rule.
Keep your Firearm secure anytime it's not under your direct personal control.
Abiding by those four rules and my little add-on would cover the majority of situations that the majority of firearms owners will ever find themselves in.
I also believe that the kind of person that won't abide by those four rules plus my one that I added isn't going to benefit if you make him go through a week long firearms safety Academy.
I've also talked about this before, when I worked for G4S when they made me an armed guard I had to take a week's worth of classes. The basic curriculum was the NRA Basic Handgun Safety Course.
Then they added a block of instruction on the legalities of OC spray and the legalities of handcuffing somebody.
They were vague enough about what circumstances would justify us putting handcuffs on anybody that I decided before I ever left that class I was never going to handcuff anybody unless God Himself sent me a burning bush.
The qualification that they put us through was the same as the handgun portion of the CSPD qualification except CSPD had a part where they had to shoot around a patrol car and they had a part that dealt with a shotgun or an AR-15. 85% was passing.
Within 6 months of taking that class of the 15 or so people that I took the class with 10 of them had been terminated by G4S and most of them for doing something inappropriate with their firearm while on duty.
You can train people all the gun safety rules in the world but you can't make them abide by them.
1. Treat all handguns as loaded at all times.
2. Never point a gun at anything you're not willing to shoot.
3. Always be aware of your Target and what's beyond it.
4. Never put your finger on the trigger until your sights are on the target and you've made a decision to shoot.
I might add one more rule.
Keep your Firearm secure anytime it's not under your direct personal control.
Abiding by those four rules and my little add-on would cover the majority of situations that the majority of firearms owners will ever find themselves in.
I also believe that the kind of person that won't abide by those four rules plus my one that I added isn't going to benefit if you make him go through a week long firearms safety Academy.
I've also talked about this before, when I worked for G4S when they made me an armed guard I had to take a week's worth of classes. The basic curriculum was the NRA Basic Handgun Safety Course.
Then they added a block of instruction on the legalities of OC spray and the legalities of handcuffing somebody.
They were vague enough about what circumstances would justify us putting handcuffs on anybody that I decided before I ever left that class I was never going to handcuff anybody unless God Himself sent me a burning bush.
The qualification that they put us through was the same as the handgun portion of the CSPD qualification except CSPD had a part where they had to shoot around a patrol car and they had a part that dealt with a shotgun or an AR-15. 85% was passing.
Within 6 months of taking that class of the 15 or so people that I took the class with 10 of them had been terminated by G4S and most of them for doing something inappropriate with their firearm while on duty.
You can train people all the gun safety rules in the world but you can't make them abide by them.
rcurtner
Professional
Same here. Belong to two club ranges they require logins & outs and what ranges used. They are very strict on safety rules if caught violating them it's probably membership cancellation. Like Bob been lucky haven't seen any severe safety violations. We don't have RSO's but members are asked to report violators.