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M1 Garand vs. M1941 Johnson Rifle Debate
- Thread starter Mike H.
- Start date
Gunz
Alpha
I've never seen a Johnson outside of pictures. The Johnson kind of went the way of the Reising submachine gun. Got combat time but never was able to compete with the legendary M-1, the M-1 Carbine, or in the Reising's case, the Thompson or the M3 Grease Gun.
10 rounds are better than 8 but I still like my M1 and my M1 Carbine.
10 rounds are better than 8 but I still like my M1 and my M1 Carbine.
HayesGreener
Ronin
Nice icons of American greatness there Gunz
USMC6094
Professional
The Johnson rifle, and LMG were near equals to the M1, the Garand just had the advantage of being developed by a government arsenal. And by the time the M1941 came along, the Garand was already standardized.
That being said, Melvin Johnsons weapons worked, and worked well.
They were used by the Para-Marines early on, and the Devils Brigade.
I missed the chance years ago to get a Mil Tech M1941 restoration, as well as MANY other missed, bucket list guns.......
That being said, Melvin Johnsons weapons worked, and worked well.
They were used by the Para-Marines early on, and the Devils Brigade.
I missed the chance years ago to get a Mil Tech M1941 restoration, as well as MANY other missed, bucket list guns.......
That pretty much sums it up.
I bought an M1941 Johnson several years ago. I did some reading to educate myself quickly.
By the time the Johnson rifle came along, the Garand rifle was solidly in place. John Garand had been employed by Springfield Armory for the purpose of designing a semi auto rifle. By the time Johnson had a prototype, Garand rifle had been adopted for almost five years and had been working on it for over twenty. When designing the rifle, Garand also designed the tooling to build them, and production lines were already cranking them out.
The only way Johnson's rifle would replace the Garand was if the Garand had problems that couldn't be solved.
But that was a possibility at the time. The Garand had its share of problems early on.
Johnson seemed to have envisioned his rifle as a Substitute Standard, like the M1917 Enfield ended up in WWI. He was designing a backup plan, and there was plenty of evidence it might be needed. If not needed as a replacement, then it might be necessary as a supplement to the Garand to meet the numbers, again like the M1917 rifle or the Colt and S&W .45 ACP M1917 revolvers from the same war.
The Johnson usually tested well against the Garand aside from one or two early tests. The thing to keep in mind with those tests is the Johnson was basically a prototype with only a few guns even made at the time, while the Garand had 20+ years of development behind it.
But the Johnson was never going to outright replace the Garand unless it simply blew the Garand away at every turn, if then. It wasn't going to happen.
As things turned out, the changes made to the Garand rifle in 1940 worked to solve most of the questions.
But it really could've gone either way for a while, and had the Garand not been refined, the entire semiautomatic changeover might not have happened without a backup plan.
Having said all that, I love the Garand. It's my favorite rifle. I have a few.
So when I had a chance to buy a 1941 Johnson so I could compare them myself, I jumped all over it.
The short version of that comparison is they both have advantages and negatives compared to each other. The Garand magazine system is what the army wanted, but the Johnson's is better in every way. But then, the Johnson trigger sucks. However, if having to deal with the corrosive primed ammo of the period, I'd rather clean 10 M1941s than one M-1.
And that's how it seems with the two. I'd decide one had the edge in one place, then find an advantage to the other.
FWIW, most of I had read before was simply wrong.
My honest opinion is the war would not have been shortened or lengthened by a day had we used M1941s instead. We had two pretty good designs as options when nobody else had just one.