Hello all, here is today's article posted on TheArmoryLife.com. It is titled “Reality Check: Red Dot Sights” and can be found at https://www.thearmorylife.com/reality-check-red-dot-sights/.
Reality Check: Red Dot Sights
- Thread starter Mike H.
- Start date
I don’t get the hate either way. Like everythjng red dots have they’re pros and irons have theirs.
But one observation a fellow Range-master instructor mentioned that is so true.
Whenever peo red dots see a failure it’s never the equipment it’s always the user
Whem the pro semi auto striker fired handgun with 20 plus rounds is the only way, whem they perceive or see an issue with a revolver it’s always the revolver!
Believe it or not everyone’s sacred can can fail both equipment and user wise!
But one observation a fellow Range-master instructor mentioned that is so true.
Whenever peo red dots see a failure it’s never the equipment it’s always the user
Whem the pro semi auto striker fired handgun with 20 plus rounds is the only way, whem they perceive or see an issue with a revolver it’s always the revolver!
Believe it or not everyone’s sacred can can fail both equipment and user wise!
Winchester67
Custom
Suppressor height sights are the key. You have spent your whole life acquiring iron sights, and with the dot at the top of the front sight the handoff is natural. Guys that hate dots and say they have to hunt the dot are missing this crucial step. I went to a dot in the 90's when I started to need reading glasses and you had to have a slide made. The Glock with a plate mounts the dot too high, not that it was around back then.
You all have seen this many times. Glock 19 frame I cut down to 26 dimensions because the butt is what is hard to hide. Suarez slide from back in the day. It takes my reading glasses out of the equation. I like it and it finally knocked the 1911 off my hip, and it had been there for decades.
You all have seen this many times. Glock 19 frame I cut down to 26 dimensions because the butt is what is hard to hide. Suarez slide from back in the day. It takes my reading glasses out of the equation. I like it and it finally knocked the 1911 off my hip, and it had been there for decades.
My observations with lasers they are just like when folks Steuben to find the dot, they whip it all over until they flag the target
The pro of a laser is if you are in an unorthodox position and can’t line up your sights/muzzle with your eye but the chance of that ……is that one time at band camp kind of thing.
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Oldmountaiman
Custom
I'm chasing down 90 and I started carrying at a early age in the mountains so I still rely on the way I have done for a life time. My son he has both and is comfortable with both. So I have a red dot on my Rugar 10-22 and that's it. Keep wife and home safe so my Iron has nothing to hang up when grabbing the XD 45 or the 1911. When I went to the range with my son he was a bit surprised at my placement on the silhouette targets. The cost of living has made extra something's out of reach. So I will just mosey along with my old fashioned equipment and take care of business and keep budget in tact.
Thanks. My 1911Pistol only iron sights good for home protection. Out in public i can use laser with proficiency from going to range for practice. Steady hands, clear eyes.
Mr. Untactical
Master Class
Stock irons on my Echelon 4.0c Comp paired with the Holosun 407K and cowitness is a breeze. I'll second the author in that being target focused (at least for me) is a significant improvement over being front-sight focused. I suspect this is in no small part due to the fact I wear progressive bifocals. Yes, I can shoot irons, but in a dynamic situation I think the pistol-mounted optic naturally gives me a wider field of view. I, for one, am on the bandwagon.
Thay's not really inspiring to know!
negolien
Operator
I also wear bi-focals and I'm thinking of going to a rmr..
Lab4Us
Custom
For me, it’s four guns with optics, five guns with irons only (full disclosure, two of those are small revolvers). Lifelong astigmatism, eyes getting older (but a little better since getting rid of the cataracts in both eyes), have pretty much always made focus on front sight while trying to include rest of sight picture a little challenging. And I never could master the art of two eyes open iron sights picture (astigmatism pretty much makes that impossible). I love the ability to keep both eyes open using an optic.
Optics have helped my shooting tremendously. That said, I can use irons if necessary, just won’t be a pinpoint shot like with an optic…100% sure I’d still hit what I was shooting at close to where I aimed.
For my guns with optics, I really don’t even consider the irons back ups. If my optic fails, I will use optic window to center on target in a SD situation (if I even have time to aim at all). I would not shoot more than 10 ft or so like that.
Well, unless it fails like this - yep, optics fail - I lived it, luckily at range. Pretty sure this wasn’t user error…
Optics have helped my shooting tremendously. That said, I can use irons if necessary, just won’t be a pinpoint shot like with an optic…100% sure I’d still hit what I was shooting at close to where I aimed.
For my guns with optics, I really don’t even consider the irons back ups. If my optic fails, I will use optic window to center on target in a SD situation (if I even have time to aim at all). I would not shoot more than 10 ft or so like that.
Well, unless it fails like this - yep, optics fail - I lived it, luckily at range. Pretty sure this wasn’t user error…
Jsimon78
Custom
MROD
Alpha
Getting past the more crap mounted on your gun aspect (red dot/light/laser), and the fact that if the weapon is for self defense, your dealing with a confrontation distance of <5 feet. Your adversary is not going to be standing facing you at 20 yards like a target. At a self defense range your not going to have time to full draw your weapon, look down the sights/red dot. So why are training that way? Why do you have junk mounted on your gun that isn't usable? Because companies want to sell toys. Train in a CQC format of <5 feet with high probably of physical contact.
Retired Fed Leo.
Retired Fed Leo.
Respectfully, Swamp Fox has a dismal record.
I am not a huge red dot guy but have been through Dave Spaulding’s class before he retired and see quite a few at classes I so myself and hist (Rangemastwr IDC and Advanve, Bolke Haggard Hearne etc) I will say the folks at the national level classes have taken time to learn to run and maintain them AND generally run quality Iptics so issues are minimal
In local classes I see folks that mount them that expect Visio magic immediately, sub standard mounting/maintenance and poor quality optics selection AND folks they never locktite the batter tray screw
It doesn’t matter what anyone thinks Optic's are here to stay. And your not going to tell anyone that is sold on them they will probably live through the. Night if the didn’t have them.
Which the 2 things I find funny folks that criticize revokvers that go down always blame the gun and nebwr the user where red dots it’s never ever the dot it’s always the person.
Mamd red dot church folks are loud critics on 1911 users because well they take more maintenance and everything else but apparently red dits with all their quirks (change batteries LLC right battery tray screws, make sure they are torque md at the proper weight, know how to use the backplate to aim if a screen goes down gets fogged up and on and on and on
I am more concerned with if a person can run a solid Baseline Assessment drill, 5 yard rohndup or Bakersfield and be 89 or above as a carrier or 90 if they claim any instructor status than if they have a dot or the don’t!
Lab4Us
Custom
No arguments here, as I lived the fail. To their credit, they replaced it with brand new matching model…which still sits in the box, unused. Only other Swampfox I tried were on a P365 and a P365XL long ago and they worked fine the entire time I possessed those guns.
During my Glock phase (which included a Hellcat and an FN Reflex MRD), aside from that one Swampfox above (wanted to try the fully enclosed style at a reasonable price back then), they were all Holosun, mostly SCS-MOS, or the smaller solar models for the micros.
My current four guns with optics are wearing a Trijicon HD, two Trijicon RMR Type IIs, and a Holosun EPS Carry (this last is on my CZ Shadow 2 Carry). Previous three are on 1911/2011 style guns.
As for why I practice with optics, for ME, over the years, and thousands of rounds, they have helped my presentation become quicker and on point.
Agree they are here to stay. Disagree they are useless (different poster). Agree it is user’s choice.
If I were on a security detail, I’d certainly use one (now knowing how they help MY accuracy) as I may have to shoot at distance across a parking lot to defeat a threat. I (ME) know that I cannot shoot as accurately at longer distances using irons. I’m sure others may have different experiences.
What frustrates me is those that have never tried using an optic long enough to become proficient with one, if at all, yet feel confident in their criticisms of others that prefer to use one.