Bassbob
Emissary
I agree. I don't even think I would have the 65 MOA circle illuminating on an AR.
Mil-dot reticles kind of defeat the purpose of a red dot, no ? They belong on scopes, not fast targeting, non magnified optics.
Red dots and the choices you made
- Thread starter TEXASforLIFE
- Start date
Mil-dot reticles kind of defeat the purpose of a red dot, no ? They belong on scopes, not fast targeting, non magnified optics.
Blackfeather
Custom
My 1st was an Aimpoint, M2 I think, then an EOTech, the old one that took 2 AA batteries. I have tried some Holosun from China, but now have Aimpoint M4s, EOTech EXPS3, and an Aimpoint Micro. All of them are on rifles... I don't care for red dots on pistols.
I got the Romeo 5 XDR and so far so good.
SimonRL
Hellcat
All right you two get a room.
Bear007
Custom
My learning curve so far ...
I bought a Sightmark a few years back just to see what all the hype was about without spending a boatload of cash. Though it's not the highest quality it did teach me a few things. 1st, the ability to switch between red & green has been very useful. Most of the time in the outdoor the green worked best for my eyes. But with a foot of snow on the ground the green was worthless, I had to use the red. There have been a few instances where switching colors was better. 2nd, because I see some dot distortion I liked being able to switch between 4 different reticle patterns, the dot for quick and close in, dot w/crosshairs for further targets. 3rd, yes, for me getting on targets is much quicker using the RDS than the fixed sights, even with the distortion.
SIGHTMARK PATTERNS
5 MOA dot
3 MOA dot with 50 MOA circle
3 MOA dot with 50 MOA crosshair
3 MOA dot with 30 MOA circle/crosshair (subtensions total 50 MOA)
I recently bought the Vortex Strikefire II (red/green) for the Ruger PC Carbine I picked up and I have to say that the dot is no clearer than the much less expensive Sightmark, so it's probably my old eyes. Shooting near is fine but the dot distortion makes hitting bullseye on further targets difficult. For further targets the dot w/crosshairs on the Sightmark make it a little more accurate ... for me.
I have a Riton X3 1x8 fully illuminated reticle scope on my SA Victor .308 and the reticle is crystal clear. Because of that and because I see also see scope non-illuminated crosshairs just fine I was thinking about trying the Vortex Crossfire II 1x4 LPVO on my AR-556 or PCC, and it still has a small (1.5 moa) illuminated red dot center for low light conditions.
So it's hard to justify a high dollar RDS if it is no clearer with my eyes than the low dollar one. Always learning something new ...
I bought a Sightmark a few years back just to see what all the hype was about without spending a boatload of cash. Though it's not the highest quality it did teach me a few things. 1st, the ability to switch between red & green has been very useful. Most of the time in the outdoor the green worked best for my eyes. But with a foot of snow on the ground the green was worthless, I had to use the red. There have been a few instances where switching colors was better. 2nd, because I see some dot distortion I liked being able to switch between 4 different reticle patterns, the dot for quick and close in, dot w/crosshairs for further targets. 3rd, yes, for me getting on targets is much quicker using the RDS than the fixed sights, even with the distortion.
SIGHTMARK PATTERNS
5 MOA dot
3 MOA dot with 50 MOA circle
3 MOA dot with 50 MOA crosshair
3 MOA dot with 30 MOA circle/crosshair (subtensions total 50 MOA)
I recently bought the Vortex Strikefire II (red/green) for the Ruger PC Carbine I picked up and I have to say that the dot is no clearer than the much less expensive Sightmark, so it's probably my old eyes. Shooting near is fine but the dot distortion makes hitting bullseye on further targets difficult. For further targets the dot w/crosshairs on the Sightmark make it a little more accurate ... for me.
I have a Riton X3 1x8 fully illuminated reticle scope on my SA Victor .308 and the reticle is crystal clear. Because of that and because I see also see scope non-illuminated crosshairs just fine I was thinking about trying the Vortex Crossfire II 1x4 LPVO on my AR-556 or PCC, and it still has a small (1.5 moa) illuminated red dot center for low light conditions.
So it's hard to justify a high dollar RDS if it is no clearer with my eyes than the low dollar one. Always learning something new ...
ddeuce22
Professional
I had the Vortex Crossfire II 1-4x LPVO (illuminated) on my Saint Victor .308 before I sold it off. The glass was excellent and the illumination was nice for low light. at a pricepoint of $150 - $200 it's a pretty solid LPVO.
Bassbob
Emissary
Have you tried lowering the brightness ? Most if not all dots will blur out at the highest settings.
Bear007
Custom
Yes I have. Both the Sightmark and Vortex have multiple intensities, 10 or so. It helps but there still isn't enough clarity at distance. When the distortion covers the entire bullseye you don't really know if you're a little high, low, left or right. So groupings suffer.
After sighting in the Vortex I actually didn't do bad here despite just covering the center diamond with the distorted red dot. The 4 smaller diamonds are 20 yds and the center is 50 yds., 3 shots each with PC Carbine 9mm and Strikefire II. I found it easier to drop below the bullseye to get an idea where it is, then move up to cover the bullseye, then squeeze the trigger.
TEXASforLIFE
SAINT
Those have been a good optic for me. I was able to get some 1-6 and 1-8 with mounts from $299 to $349. Change that, they are the strikeagle. I do have some strikefire2 on 300bo. Vortex have been a good optic choice. I will try a holosun or 2 when I get a choice made.
Does the visual aberration/distortion appear *consistently* to you, not between different sights, but at least for each sight?
What I mean is, well, let's take take a hypothetical sight called the "X," sight, does the way the dot appears in that sight X always appear the same to you. For example, is it always a "comma" with a brighter dot at the upper left and a comet-tail off to the right? Or maybe it always appears as a "starburst" with a more distinct/sharply-resolved "beam" on the right?
If so, it's possible that you can use a visually distinct area of that aberration/distortion as a more refined aiming point.
I have not-insignificant astigmatism in both eyes. so working with RDS -particularly when combined with my nearsightedness- has always been a battle.
That said, I've learned how to stretch out to well beyond the 200 yard mark (with my goal being the 300, which is what a very well-respected SME on this topic suggested that good shooters should be able to do, even with astigmatism).Another thing to pursue would be your corrective eyewear (if any) and eyepro. Insuring good alignment of your corrective eyewear when you are looking through the dot on the pistol or when checking a rifle. as well as making sure that your eyepro is of good optical quality and isn't itself causing any distortions, can both help significantly as well.
Bear007
Custom
I do wear bifocals. I lowered both RDS to their lowest intensities and I can see what looks like a comma in both sights, curled left at the top and coming down angled to the left about 200° with the dot about 1/3rd the way down. At that intensity neither is very useful. As I increase the intensity the distortion gets much worse, scrambled, changing with intensities and even double vision, it doesn't matter which RDS or if I'm using red or green.Does the visual aberration/distortion appear *consistently* to you, not between different sights, but at least for each sight?
What I mean is, well, let's take take a hypothetical sight called the "X," sight, does the way the dot appears in that sight X always appear the same to you. For example, is it always a "comma" with a brighter dot at the upper left and a comet-tail off to the right? Or maybe it always appears as a "starburst" with a more distinct/sharply-resolved "beam" on the right?
If so, it's possible that you can use a visually distinct area of that aberration/distortion as a more refined aiming point.
I have not-insignificant astigmatism in both eyes. so working with RDS -particularly when combined with my nearsightedness- has always been a battle.
Another thing to pursue would be your corrective eyewear (if any) and eyepro. Insuring good alignment of your corrective eyewear when you are looking through the dot on the pistol or when checking a rifle. as well as making sure that your eyepro is of good optical quality and isn't itself causing any distortions, can both help significantly as well.
So if I see the same distorted pattern in the Sightmark and the Vortex it's a pretty good bet I'm what's broken.
Bassbob
Emissary
Sounds like maybe you should try a Prism scope.I do wear bifocals. I lowered both RDS to their lowest intensities and I can see what looks like a comma in both sights, curled left at the top and coming down angled to the left about 200° with the dot about 1/3rd the way down. At that intensity neither is very useful. As I increase the intensity the distortion gets much worse, scrambled, changing with intensities and even double vision, it doesn't matter which RDS or if I'm using red or green.
So if I see the same distorted pattern in the Sightmark and the Vortex it's a pretty good bet I'm what's broken.
Bear007
Custom
Hmmm, there you go throwing more terminology at me.
Not knowing anything about prism scopes, except that they cost more than an RDS, I would have to learn a bunch before I took the plunge.
I found this to be a good, basic, and very understandable read on prism scopes that explores both its positives and negatives -
opticsmag.com
Unfortunately as you noted, prismatics do tend to be a bit more costly than non-holographic RDS offerings, but this is really just par-for-course, due to the optical complexities and components involved.
And similar to powered "traditional" optical scopes, the shooter will not be able to properly cowitness BUIS through prismatic scopes.
^ Yup, unfortunately, it's you.
Alas, not all of us can have perfect vision.
If you really, really want a non-magnified dot and astigmatism or other vision shortfalls makes a traditional RDS limiting for you, the prismatic might really be your thing.
Prism Scope vs Red Dot Sight: Which Is Better? A Complete Comparison - Optics Mag
Before you buy yourself a prism or a red dot sight you should know which one will be best suited to your needs. That's why we've compared the two in this extensive...
opticsmag.com
Unfortunately as you noted, prismatics do tend to be a bit more costly than non-holographic RDS offerings, but this is really just par-for-course, due to the optical complexities and components involved.
And similar to powered "traditional" optical scopes, the shooter will not be able to properly cowitness BUIS through prismatic scopes.
I do wear bifocals. I lowered both RDS to their lowest intensities and I can see what looks like a comma in both sights, curled left at the top and coming down angled to the left about 200° with the dot about 1/3rd the way down. At that intensity neither is very useful. As I increase the intensity the distortion gets much worse, scrambled, changing with intensities and even double vision, it doesn't matter which RDS or if I'm using red or green.
So if I see the same distorted pattern in the Sightmark and the Vortex it's a pretty good bet I'm what's broken.
^ Yup, unfortunately, it's you.
Alas, not all of us can have perfect vision.If you really, really want a non-magnified dot and astigmatism or other vision shortfalls makes a traditional RDS limiting for you, the prismatic might really be your thing.
Keystone19250
SAINT
Although I do suffer with astigmatism issues in both eyes as well as M.D. in my left I refuse to let the fact that “at times” I’m not seeing a perfect round dot.I found this to be a good, basic, and very understandable read on prism scopes that explores both its positives and negatives -
Prism Scope vs Red Dot Sight: Which Is Better? A Complete Comparison - Optics Mag
Before you buy yourself a prism or a red dot sight you should know which one will be best suited to your needs. That's why we've compared the two in this extensive...
Unfortunately as you noted, prismatics do tend to be a bit more costly than non-holographic RDS offerings, but this is really just par-for-course, due to the optical complexities and components involved.
And similar to powered "traditional" optical scopes, the shooter will not be able to properly cowitness BUIS through prismatic scopes.
^ Yup, unfortunately, it's you.
If you really, really want a non-magnified dot and astigmatism or other vision shortfalls makes a traditional RDS limiting for you, the prismatic might really be your thing.
I have 3 pairs of corrective eyewear and found quickly that one pair does an incredible job at correcting my eyesight to see a near perfect dot, for me it’s training and consistency not perfection. I’m focusing on using the Holosun as an aid to POI not a cure all.
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Bassbob
Emissary
I don't know if I have astigmatism or not. I know I need cheaters to read up close these days. My long range vision seems to be fine. According to eye charts I have 20-20 in one eye and 20-30 in the other. Nevertheless, I see a tinge of starburst regardless of which optic I am looking through. Just a tinge. I'll still blow your eyeball out at 50 yards so I don't care.
Michaelk1950
Alpha
Was wondering the same thing?