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The Irony

jumpinjoe said:
As I recall most all those old model single action revolvers had a pretty long hammer stroke before actually cocking/locking into a firing position. If that's the case, then it makes sense and is possible he could have pulled the hammer back to a point that when released, and if released quickly and completely, it could have struck the cartridge primer hard enough to detonate it, and from there we know the result.
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Both my Colt replicas are Ubertis. Both of them finish rotating the cylinder into battery in the last tiny bit of the hammer's movement. If dropped from over halfway back, the firing pin wouldn't have a primer under it. Then the half cock notch might catch it, also. After that there is a safety notch, that holds the hammer back an eight inch or so.
Old SAs are primitive but when they are not broken or badly worn they didn't leave much leeway for ADs.
Striking the hammer while it's down (un-cocked) could indeed cause them to fire. Like dropping them on a loaded chamber.
It's not something I would care to experiment with (maybe with a blank) but if his gun was a quality replica his dropping the hammer on accident story falls apart.
When the hand has fully rotated the cylinder and the bolt clicks into its notch, the hammer is already caught by the sear.

I'd like to have a look at the gun in question for five minutes.
 
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conax said:
Both my Colt replicas are Ubertis. Both of them finish rotating the cylinder into battery in the last tiny bit of the hammer's movement. If dropped from over halfway back, the firing pin wouldn't have a primer under it.
It's not something I would care to experiment with (maybe with a blank) but if his gun was a quality replica his dropping the hammer on accident story falls apart.
When the hand has fully rotated the cylinder and the bolt clicks into its notch, the hammer is already caught by the sear.

I'd like to have a look at the gun in question for five minutes.
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I’m sure the authorities will be inspecting and testing that gun extensively after that last news conference. His denying now that he didn’t pull the trigger flys in the face as a bold face lie after he is on record in a previous interview saying that
“I pulled the trigger”
 
Annihilator said:
This is where I disagree with you Joe, Baldwin is an actor, that was an act, it’s all about him now, he knew better then to cock the hammer and pull the trigger, it seems funny now all of a sudden he states he didn’t pull the trigger, and the so called witness said I didn’t see him pull the trigger, all fake just to cover Baldwin a$$, just my thoughts.
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nothing against you JJ I just felt the same way anni felt he fake like he was in a movie he is an actor nothing against him but he flat out lied
 
javbike said:
nothing against you JJ I just felt the same way anni felt he fake like he was in a movie he is an actor nothing against him but he flat out lied
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Disagreement is OK guys, I don't take it personally. I'm just basing my opinion on some amount of study of the human animal's personalities, emotions, actions and reactions. It's more a gut feeling than anything since I do not believe in 'psyco babble' to any great degree. I don't believe anyone can get inside another's head unless that person wants them to believe they got inside. But hey, that's a whole other issue.

As for the gun having all the newest bells and whistles, somewhere I heard the gun in question was not a modern replica but a genuine article. If that's the case, and a sixth cartridge was in the cylinder, then a dropped hammer would/could be a cause for an accidental discharge, exactly the reason old cowboys typically carried with the hammer on an empty cylinder. We won't know that issue till all the facts come out.

And your assertion that he said "I pulled the trigger" is something I wouldn't doubt, but had not heard that myself. In fact the only interview I've seen of him was that short take version from late last night. Regardless of how we personally feel or think, we owe him the opportunity of his right to a presumption of innocence until proven beyond a reasonable doubt guilty. That's really all I'm saying. (y)(y)(y)
 
jumpinjoe said:
Disagreement is OK guys, I don't take it personally. I'm just basing my opinion on some amount of study of the human animal's personalities, emotions, actions and reactions. It's more a gut feeling than anything since I do not believe in 'psyco babble' to any great degree. I don't believe anyone can get inside another's head unless that person wants them to believe they got inside. But hey, that's a whole other issue.

As for the gun having all the newest bells and whistles, somewhere I heard the gun in question was not a modern replica but a genuine article. If that's the case, and a sixth cartridge was in the cylinder, then a dropped hammer would/could be a cause for an accidental discharge, exactly the reason old cowboys typically carried with the hammer on an empty cylinder. We won't know that issue till all the facts come out.

And your assertion that he said "I pulled the trigger" is something I wouldn't doubt, but had not heard that myself. In fact the only interview I've seen of him was that short take version from late last night. Regardless of how we personally feel or think, we owe him the opportunity of his right to a presumption of innocence until proven beyond a reasonable doubt guilty. That's really all I'm saying. (y)(y)(y)
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Karma; my what a fickle bitch she is...
I have no use for the guy. Him and his twitter account were always in action denigrating and shaming others in shootings whether justified or not always before the facts were out. Now as the fingers point at him he has blamed everyone else for the shooting but Donald Trump. that interview was nothing but a self-serving piece that shows how out of touch with reality he is and how disingenuous his apology for the shooting was. I have absolutely no doubts that it was a tragic accident and there is plenty of blame to go around but him not at least publicly accepting his part in this tragedy shows him for the worm that he is.
 
OK folks. Time to set the record straight. It's not about AB. What has been proven here is that firearms are so dangerous they must be banned; those instruments can and will "go off" of their own volition anywhere anytime.
They can be "safe", "contain blanks", or any other condition, yet without pulling the trigger or mishandling they go BOOM! and people get killed. See? It's not about people, it's about a dangerous piece of iron/steel/composite that, independent of a human, just......well........."goes off"!! AB was a victim of this phenomenon, he (nor anyone else, apparently) is at fault; it's that damn firearm, it's dangerous, get rid of them!! Dismiss all charges and allow this victim to continue as the compassionate Poster Boy for the banning of firearms!
 
C. Sumpin said:
OK folks. Time to set the record straight. It's not about AB. What has been proven here is that firearms are so dangerous they must be banned; those instruments can and will "go off" of their own volition anywhere anytime.
They can be "safe", "contain blanks", or any other condition, yet without pulling the trigger or mishandling they go BOOM! and people get killed. See? It's not about people, it's about a dangerous piece of iron/steel/composite that, independent of a human, just......well........."goes off"!! AB was a victim of this phenomenon, he (nor anyone else, apparently) is at fault; it's that damn firearm, it's dangerous, get rid of them!! Dismiss all charges and allow this victim to continue as the compassionate Poster Boy for the banning of firearms!
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C. Sumpin, with all due respect, if I hadn't seen previous posts by you and understand the knack for sarcasm, I'd think this diatribe was a full fledged attack on guns by a pro gun man. Here's why. The written word does not and cannot convey the nuance of the spoken word, and especially where the spoken words are spoken in plain sight of the listener. Most of us here will understand your intent and take it for what it is, but there are those who will find this just what they need to inflame an argument in favor of more controls.

For someone outside the pro gun community in general, and this forum in particular to read this, your post would be/could be an advertisement for those who would push an anti-gun agenda. IE: "Here, look what this pro gun guy wrote on a gun forum where he didn't think any anti gun folks were likely to see it!" Now I'm certainly not implying that was your intention nor that you even gave it much thought, but it is something worth thinking about in everything we, as responsible and sensible law-abiding gun owners do and say. It's us, the pro gun side which is under attack via attacks on the 2nd amendment, so it's up to us to project the best front we can.

I'm not saying we have anything to be ashamed of, nor anything we need to hide, but we all need to be cautious of the things we say/write/post, or how we say them, that will be available to the general public, especially those who are on the lookout for words to throw right back at us.

Certainly no offense was/is intended ..... certainly hope none was taken. (y) (y)(y)
 
You got a point there Joe; I assumed everyone knew when I was being a Sm As or sarcastic, much humor for me.
Perhaps I can restrain myself or use smileys to indicate it's all satire?
 
jumpinjoe said:
I'm not saying we have anything to be ashamed of, nor anything we need to hide, but we all need to be cautious of the things we say/write/post, or how we say them, that will be available to the general public, especially those who are on the lookout for words to throw right back at us.
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Geesh Joe, It was heir apparent that his tongue was firmly implanted in his cheek. I was actually going to tell him that he needs to post a warning sort of like a NSFW type of thing seeing how I passed my coffee through my nose while reading it.
 
BreakingWind said:
Geesh Joe, It was heir apparent that his tongue was firmly implanted in his cheek. I was actually going to tell him that he needs to post a warning sort of like a NSFW type of thing seeing how I passed my coffee through my nose while reading it.
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Absolutely it was apparent to most of us here who have interacted with C. Sumpin over some time. That was not my point. I tried to make the point very clear by saying "if I hadn't seen previous posts by you and understand the knack for sarcasm, I'd think this diatribe was a full fledged attack on guns by a pro gun man." And then went on to explain why/how some who were not familiar with him might see it a different way.

There was no chastising, or lecture of any kind and I actually chuckled a time or two myself ...... but just a reminder that the nuances (tone of voice, body language, facial expressions, etc, etc) that go along with the spoken word do not go along with the written word. I've seen it time and again. C. Sumpin saw what I was trying to say and agreed.

We all need to be careful of the words we choose to use on any kind of social media. Always remember...... 'WORDS MEAN THINGS' !!! And there are lots of folks who will take full advantage.
(y)(y)(y):)
 
C. Sumpin said:
You got a point there Joe; I assumed everyone knew when I was being a Sm As or sarcastic, much humor for me.
Perhaps I can restrain myself or use smileys to indicate it's all satire?
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As 'BreakingWind' has said he saw it the way intended, so did I, as most others here on the forum did. It's those who actually troll the I-net and other sources of social media looking for stuff like that they can twist to their advantage. It's all good man. Yeh, maybe bring on the smileys !!! (y)(y)(y)
 
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