Pistol Brace Rule Drops

[TacticalPirate]

Never be enforced by the state maybe. Doesn’t mean the feds won’t enforce it.

Dude, there are ten to forty million of them out there. It’s beyond common use, that’s over ten percent plus of the US population. Utterly impossible.

There are potentially enough out there to arm the entire state of California.

 

[TacticalPirate]

This Rule also runs straight into the ex post facto law clause in the Constitution (Article 1, Section 9, Clause 3 (with respect to federal laws)).

ex post facto

www.law.cornell.edu

https://scholarship.law.georgetown.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2437&context=facpub&httpsredir=1&referer=

And the common use defined by Heller, and the parameters of agency authority stipulated by the recent Cargill vs Garland ruling in the Fifth Circuit.

 

[Annihilator]

Do you actually believe they (ATF) are going to give a free tax exempt stamp? I don’t believe anything this current administration says, call me cautious, paranoid or whatever, I don’t believe it

 

[TacticalPirate]

Do you actually believe they (ATF) are going to give a free tax exempt stamp? I don’t believe anything this current administration says, call me cautious, paranoid or whatever, I don’t believe it

If they do it’s in violation of the NFA itself

 

[Belt Fed]

Do you actually believe they (ATF) are going to give a free tax exempt stamp?

Nah not for a second i believe that. It ain't like they have lied in the past.

 

[Talyn]

An explanation of Cargill vs. Garland for the lay person.

Bump Stock Ban Regulation Isn't Authorized by Federal Law, Says Fifth Circuit En Banc

From the majority opinion, by Judge Jennifer Walker Elrod, in Cargill v. Garland: Since the National Firearms Act of 1934, federal...

reason.com

 

[TacticalPirate]

An explanation of Cargill vs. Garland for the lay person.

Bump Stock Ban Regulation Isn't Authorized by Federal Law, Says Fifth Circuit En Banc

From the majority opinion, by Judge Jennifer Walker Elrod, in Cargill v. Garland: Since the National Firearms Act of 1934, federal...

reason.com

I was on the radio show with Cargill and Rare Breed trigger president Lawrence DeMonico this last Sunday, we had a great two hour discussion with each other and Cargill’s attorneys.

Needless to say, the ATF is just throwing stuff at the wall at this point, the courts that matter aren’t on their side anymore.

 

[Minuteman76]

so if a guy has a pistol that he was considering converting to use a regular stock anyway..... would he be compelled to do it now ahead of the deadline or hope that this gets shot down in court and wait?

I agree this is an ex post facto law criminalizing what was previously legal purchase/posession/use. I may err on the side of AR pistol to SBR conversion, paying the $200 and putting on a stock (since I was planning to do that anyway)...but I'm hesitant because I don't want to enable this kind of behavior by 8-tee-F

 

[TacticalPirate]

so if a guy has a pistol that he was considering converting to use a regular stock anyway..... would he be compelled to do it now ahead of the deadline or hope that this gets shot down in court and wait?

I agree this is an ex post facto law criminalizing what was previously legal purchase/posession/use. I may err on the side of AR pistol to SBR conversion, paying the $200 and putting on a stock (since I was planning to do that anyway)...but I'm hesitant because I don't want to enable this kind of behavior by 8-tee-F

I’d be very careful trusting these so called free tax stamps. They’re constitutionally dubious and could be a retroactive headache for you.

 

[Minuteman76]

I’d be very careful trusting these so called free tax stamps. They’re constitutionally dubious and could be a retroactive headache for you.

so, pay the tax, get the forms in for NFA, remove the stabilizer brace, then once in receipt of the stamp, put on a stock? Is that what you're suggesting--? what'd i miss?

 

[TacticalPirate]

so, pay the tax, get the forms in for NFA, remove the stabilizer brace, then once in receipt of the stamp, put on a stock? Is that what you're suggesting--? what'd i miss?

Make an SBR independent of pistol braces is my suggestion.
Personally I'd wait because I think there is probability SBRs are declared common use on account of the attempt to redefine pistols, and that they are removed from the NFA.

To me, that's worth waiting to see, because I see no gain in complying with the pistol redefinition to get a tax stamp that is constitutionally dubious for the ATF to be handing out without collecting a tax.

 

[Minuteman76]

Make an SBR independent of pistol braces is my suggestion.
Personally I'd wait because I think there is probability SBRs are declared common use on account of the attempt to redefine pistols, and that they are removed from the NFA.

To me, that's worth waiting to see, because I see no gain in complying with the pistol redefinition to get a tax stamp that is constitutionally dubious for the ATF to be handing out without collecting a tax.

I think i understand.
I own an AR Pistol w/ a brace and am considering converting to SBR just by paying the tax, replacing the brace for a stock and calling it good. That is a legit conversion, right? I won't be changing the barrel though (7.5")

 

[SaltyMonkey]

This won’t go anywhere but…
Gaetz introduces 'Abolish the ATF Act' after ruling against stabilizing braces

 

[Bassbob]

I have a hard time wrapping my head around why anyone would register anything with the federal government much less pay the $200 tax.

The whole point of this new rule is to get every braced pistol registered. So they know where they are.

 

[Minuteman76]

I have a hard time wrapping my head around why anyone would register anything with the federal government much less pay the $200 tax.

The whole point of this new rule is to get every braced pistol registered. So they know where they are.

totally agree--I'd rather not do this at all
they know where they are anyway, the FFL purchased ones..not the gun show purchases.

 

[uspatriot1960]

totally agree--I'd rather not do this at all
they know where they are anyway, the FFL purchased ones..not the gun show purchases.

Gun show purchases? Are you talking about an individual to individual purchase? That doesn't have to happen at a gun show. This "Gun Show Loophole" thing pisses me off. No such thing.

 

[uspatriot1960]

so if a guy has a pistol that he was considering converting to use a regular stock anyway..... would he be compelled to do it now ahead of the deadline or hope that this gets shot down in court and wait?

I agree this is an ex post facto law criminalizing what was previously legal purchase/posession/use. I may err on the side of AR pistol to SBR conversion, paying the $200 and putting on a stock (since I was planning to do that anyway)...but I'm hesitant because I don't want to enable this kind of behavior by 8-tee-F

I'd wait for now. This "rule" hasn't even been published yet. Once it's published, there is a 120 day grace period to do what you think is right. If you were going to convert anyway, take advantage of the "amnesty" and not pay the $200 tax. But a lot can happen over the next 4 to 4 1/2 months. I do have a pistol, and I like it. I'm waiting to find out what happens. Maybe around the 3 month mark after seeing where this will stand, I'll take advantage of the "free" stamp, but I don't even want to do that if I don't have to. I'm certainly not going to completely ignore it and take the chance of a felony with a possible 10 years in prison and a $10,000 fine.

 

[Bassbob]

totally agree--I'd rather not do this at all
they know where they are anyway, the FFL purchased ones..not the gun show purchases.

Gun shows are staffed by dealers. Unless you're buying something out of the trunk of someone's car in the parking lot.

And the thing is they may know a transaction occurred involving you, but unless they have the 4473 they don't know what it is. And even if they do have the 4473, if you bought a stripped lower it's not going to be listed as a pistol. And even if you bought a pistol they have no way of knowing if it has a brace.

 

[Minuteman76]

Gun show purchases? Are you talking about an individual to individual purchase? That doesn't have to happen at a gun show. This "Gun Show Loophole" thing pisses me off. No such thing.

Gun show purchases? Are you talking about an individual to individual purchase? That doesn't have to happen at a gun show. This "Gun Show Loophole" thing pisses me off. No such thing.

right, I meant that the last one i did just so happened to have occurred at a gun show...

 

[10mmLife]

Here's something to ponder if you're thinking of taking advantage of the pistol brace ruling for the waived tax stamp to classify your firearm as an SBR.