Hello all, here is today's article posted on TheArmoryLife.com. It is titled “Ayoob: Will Carrying a 10mm Hang You in Court?” and can be found at https://www.thearmorylife.com/harold-fish-10mm-court-case/.
Ayoob: Will Carrying a 10mm Hang You in Court?
- Thread starter Mike H.
- Start date
PieterCoetzee
Operator
Good article. My take away is that his full story was NEVER told, and that juries are made up of people who couldnt find away to avoid jury duty. Ive seen one juror called who couldnt speak English.
Its also a case of not articulating the circumstances well enough at the scene BEFORE the police write the report. A prosecutor would never have seen the report if the shooter had been listed as the only VICTIM. You can not wait for an attorney before making a statement.
Its also a case of not articulating the circumstances well enough at the scene BEFORE the police write the report. A prosecutor would never have seen the report if the shooter had been listed as the only VICTIM. You can not wait for an attorney before making a statement.
Career woodsman
Alpha
G9 woodsman +p is the certainmy my preferred ammunition in bear country. Cougars and wolves can be neutralized with 9mm hollow points.
The lack of any self defense insurance while carrying concealed or not was both a serious tactical error and a monumental strategic error. He spent 3 years in prison and 5 years fighting with an incompetent defense while facing a bad prosecutor. I have no doubt that his death from cancer was a large factor in his realtively early death.
With all due respect the article title is paradoxical at best, but I am not in the least bit surprised given the relative knowledge level of the typical EDC/gun buyer of recent times (with all due respect to Mr. Ayoob whose pedigree is self explanatory). These illogical questions are not really no worth asking because they really do not have an answer How can a firearm be too lethal? Are you any less in trouble if I shot someone with a $23,000 Krieghoff shotgun, seven times with a Raven MP-25, or emptied the magazine on them with a registered machine gun? Shot is shot....
Anchorite
Custom
Don't know the facts in this case beyond the article, haven't read the pleadings or the record. Have not seen any discovery.
I can say that having been trying all manner of cases to juries for 20-plus years now, you just never know what a jury will do. They are always unpredictable. They are human.
I can say that having been trying all manner of cases to juries for 20-plus years now, you just never know what a jury will do. They are always unpredictable. They are human.
vjb.knife1
Operator
Not to mention liberal douchebag Prosecuter.
I didn’t catch it in this article but I believe another issue was there was a huge discrepancy on whem the incident happened to time or reporting.
As far as the Sig’s this also is a great case as to why the use of OC/pepper spray as most states a warning shot IS Deadly Force!
I am sure the Sig’s owners wasnIN a temper train and would have still some what he did but when you start out less lethal (ie no warning shots) your not hurting your case
As far as the Sig’s this also is a great case as to why the use of OC/pepper spray as most states a warning shot IS Deadly Force!
I am sure the Sig’s owners wasnIN a temper train and would have still some what he did but when you start out less lethal (ie no warning shots) your not hurting your case
vjb.knife1
Operator
I have a SA XDM Elite 10mm and althogh it is not my carry gun, I would not mind doing so if it weren't for this kind of situation. I also have the XDM in 40 cal which is a favorite.
That is fuddlore at its finest, like using a M2 on personnel during combat is a war crime. Self defense is self defense and if a prosecutor is defending a criminal who was shot, doesn’t matter what caliber it is, they’re going to spin it. Why didn’t you use a 38 revolver?! A semiautomatic is overkill! *clutches pearls* it’s a wepun of wuhr!!!
tkocian
Alpha
Every course I have ever taken, or spoken to experts, read about EDC and self defense...you are supposed to carry hollow point rounds...anything other than FMJ so that the round stays in the intended target. Poor guy had a bad lawyer, an a hole prosecutor and a judge that obviously doesn't know his *** from a hole in the ground.
Jsimon78
Professional
I have carried the M&P M2.0 10MM and Glock G23.5. Defense is defense in my opinion.
An improper lawyer, defined as one who thinks lot's of training makes you a gun nut, is more conducive to being hung out to dry in a courtroom than is the caliber weapon you are carrying. If you are are charged you need more than a public defender or a lawyer who may be your friend. Your lawyer needs to be carefully selected based on their demonstrated trial record... IMHO, it is more important again than your caliber choice.
Those are questions of jurors which all practitioners of Jurisprudence must try to wrap their heads around- i.e. do not have engineers on your jury, etc. which fall outside the scope of the instrumentality in question or how it was used; but a competent consulting expert certainly gives one an advantage.... I happen to know where such expertise can be found.
Engineers are also a stubborn bunch who would acquit because they judge and/or prosecutors are clueless jackwagons. (I’m an engineer and know plenty more like me when it comes to detecting railroading, lies, and misrepresentation)