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Check Your Hex Optic Battery and How to Zero RDS

So I threw out a bunch of fairly new batteries several months ago so that I could avoid having several different dates for battery changes. There is an alarm on my phone and computer that prompts me to change the batteries in all my optics. I also carry spare batteries in the grips of the rifles and have spares in my range bag.
 
So,

Just got back from the range to check the Zero of the Wasp since I had to take it off to replace the battery earlier today.

It was off about 2 to 2.5 inches low and 1 inch to the left.

Got it Zero'ed back in and now punching holes about the size of a quarter at 7 yards.

I know it's not 15 or 25 yards, but for me that is good.

As far as the tip someone earlier posted about torquing the screws and then lining up a white mark he made across the screw head and base of the optic, and by doing this he was dead on Zero from last time.

What I don't understand is how can you be sure the screws are started into the screw holes at the exact same place?

Maybe there is something about the mechanics or physics of a screw that I'm unaware of, but does a screw always line up the same way every time?

In my mind, I'm thinking of the end of the screw having numbers around it like a clock for example.

Let's say you started the screw into the base of the red dot with the 1 o'clock position of the screw at the 1 o'clock position of the screw hole.

Once tightened you make your white alignment mark.

You take the screw back out, but when you put it back in, is it not possible that you place the 6 o'clock position of the screw at the 1 o'clock position of the screw hole?

So when tightened, wouldn't the white mark now be 180 degrees off?

Or, is it the mechanics of the screw threads and matching screw hole such that, the screw will only start when the screw's 1 o'clock is at the screw hole 1 o'clock?
i too practice from the 5 to 8 yard distances, as with in those "limits" is what the USCCA (and i think the FBI) say that most interactions happen with a thug. (sometimes even closer than 5 yards i'm thinking)

for me to practice at say my state's CCW distance of 25 yards (or 75 feet away) is ludacris.

if someone is that far away, then i got time to "beat feet" outta there and avoid confrontation(s)
 
i too practice from the 5 to 8 yard distances, as with in those "limits" is what the USCCA (and i think the FBI) say that most interactions happen with a thug. (sometimes even closer than 5 yards i'm thinking)

for me to practice at say my state's CCW distance of 25 yards (or 75 feet away) is ludacris.

if someone is that far away, then i got time to "beat feet" outta there and avoid confrontation(s)
That's what I figure.

If I zero at 7 yards, then I should be good should SHTF at 7 yards or less.

To Zero at 25 yards, not sure how that would change POI at 5 or 7 yards.

It would only take being a few inches off to miss my target and hit a bystander.

Like you say, I feel a lot more comfortable in winning a "self defense" claim if I had to shoot at a target 5-7 yards away, versus 25 yards or even 15 yards away.
 
Never zero a firearm at 5 yards. The distance in POI from 25 yards to 6’ is minimal with a 25 yard zero on a handgun. If you Zero at 25 yards you might be off by 1” at 10 feet.
Exactly, to say you will "never" need to shoot at an extended range is, in my opinion, short sighted. I once read an article where an officer was ambushed out in field by an AR weilding assailant. He had accidently stumbled into a drug grow.

He was hit several times, once in the testicles and left arm I believe. He was prone and being fired upon, and he had to return fire with his M&P 9mm, the distance was I believe in the 75 yard range. He had practiced long distance shooting and was able to neutralize the shooter before he got hit more.

One never knows what may occur.
 
Exactly, to say you will "never" need to shoot at an extended range is, in my opinion, short sighted. I once read an article where an officer was ambushed out in field by an AR weilding assailant. He had accidently stumbled into a drug grow.

He was hit several times, once in the testicles and left arm I believe. He was prone and being fired upon, and he had to return fire with his M&P 9mm, the distance was I believe in the 75 yard range. He had practiced long distance shooting and was able to neutralize the shooter before he got hit more.

One never knows what may occur.
Well then...

If getting Zero'ed at 25 yards can help keep me from getting shot in the testicles... Then I'm all in balls deep at going back to the range and having a do-over.
 
Well then...

If getting Zero'ed at 25 yards can help keep me from getting shot in the testicles... Then I'm all in balls deep at going back to the range and having a do-over.
Red, I don't remember right off hand at what distance the Hellcat's iron sights are set, but IIRC, you can set the red dot right on top of the front sight as if the irons are used in the 6:00 method, and you will be <1" above or below the line of sight all the way out to 50+ yards.

I'm not stating exact numbers because there are so many possibilities/variables such as cartridge brand, bullet weight, bullet design/type, size of the red dot, ambient temperatures, etc, etc, etc. Make the sights look as if the red dot is actually sitting on the very top edge of the front iron sight. Then take it the range and shoot a few rounds ....... you'll find you're sighted at 25yrds +-.

I don't have a 9mm ballistic chart right handy, but from memory I'm pretty sure I'm telling you right. It'll at least get you in a very close ball park with what you want. (y)(y)(y) You can fine tune from there if needed.
 
Look at it this way -

At 10 yards or less, what's the likelihood that you'll even get to use your sights, before the fight is literally "on top of you?"

Understand that the handgun is in-reality a very poor -objective- fight-stopper. The terminal ballistics just isn't there in the way that it is for a long-gun. Thus, if the aggressor is charging at you full-tilt with a contact weapon, in the case of the canonical "Tueller Drill," understand that in the real-world, that aggressor may well mortally wound you even as he/she dies of the gunshot wound(s) you inflicted on them, simply because they're just heading so fast in your direction that they fall on/at you even with their dying breath (and even if the contact weapon doesn't come into play, if you're bowled-over and hit your head on the pavement or an object, that's still far from ideal).

Now, with this in-mind, play the following game without even using a firearm: have a training partner aggressively advance on you form 7 to 10 yards away. Make your partner's goal consensual but competitive - he/she should come at you in a straight line so that you can easily drop a bead on them with your "hands in the shape of a gun" or with a training aid (below). Starting at just a purposeful walk, as them to accelerate up to a full charge in subsequent trials: the idea is for them to try to reach you and tag you somewhere on the torso before you can raise your hands in front of you and yell "stop," as though you were drawing down and firing on them.

A water-gun will make this even more enjoyable on a hot summer day. Got an airsoft pistol and some eye protection? All the better. This is even possible live-fire, with the defender (the person with the firearm) shooting at, say, a full-size torso from the 7 to 10 yard line, while the aggressor attempts to cover the distance specified in the drill, albeit on a perpendicular axis safely behind the shooter. A bystander or just the aggressor can assess where the charge ended, when the shot breaks.

So most folks will then say that it's an easy fix, they'll just move....

And many times, these same folks have never tried to draw or shoot while moving aggressively/dynamically. And even fewer will have practiced doing so versus a moving target (one whose profile/size is effectively decreasing and who is actually displacing more arc as they draw nearer, due to both how the actual human body and its vital anatomy will present as it blades to the side, as well as the law of inverse proportions [imagine that you wanted to toss a frisbee to your friend who is running full-tilt perpendicular to you, at a distance of 5 ft. versus a distance of 50 ft.).

Zeroing at 5 to 7 yards may make for easy work in the belt-buckle-to-belt-buckle world of a flat range or in an otherwise static context.... In the real-world, it's really going to make for more trouble than it will be of assistance, at any distance.

For those who need to zero in-particular their ARs at closer distances due to range limitations, a properly calibrated 10-yard target can help you get reasonably close to a true 50-yard zero:


and


^ ....but understand that at 10 yards, you really, really need to put forward a 110% effort and try to make those bullet holes from your zeroing groups are all touching each other. Because of the truncated distance, you are effectively artificially minimizing the deleterious effects seen of imperfect marksmanship practices that would have otherwise showed up as you actually pushed yardage during your 50 or 100 yard zero.

To zero a service/defensive pistol, the standard is to print groups off a bag or rest at the 25 yard line. Freestyle unsupported, the shooter and gun combo should be able to print a 5 inch group at that same distance (reason? Larry Vickers explains it well ---> https://www.vickerstactical.com/accuracy.html ; and in order to achieve this level of performance, a shooter will need to be able to produce the following level of accuracy/precision as Tim Herron demonstrated at the 7 yard line: https://www.unitedgungroup.com/news/2016/11/21/tim-herron/ - video format:
)

With modern service/defensive calibers, anything from a sub-compact to full-size handgun will only require "point-of-aim/point-of-impact" holds to effect appropriately accurate-for-circumstances shots (i.e. "surgical" at closer distances, to "center-mass" at upwards of even 100 yards).

With long-guns with height-over-bore considerations for sights, such as the AR, the shooter must be well-practiced in holding for mechanical offset at shorter distances.

While most lethal-force scenarios where us average-Joe/Jane law-abiding citizens may find ourselves needing to go to our gun are cited as firing the mold of "3-ft., 3 rounds, 3 seconds," we should recognize the fact that these are the parameters where the confrontation *_ends_*. At such closer distances and with little time to react, I humbly submit that it is less about using the gun -or any tool- to solve the problem: that it is simply about solving the problem.

That, and take a look at your real world....

Is the Nike Defense necessarily always possible when the setting is a restaurant, gas-station market or a corner drugstore, a large grocery store or "big-box shop" (for a real eye-opener, pace out the distances there, and search up some incidences in the last decade or so of civilian-involved defensive shootings in those surroundings), or even a movie theater?

As Clint Smith says, it's true that mediocre shooting often carries the fight. I'll take luck over skill, any day. But he also insists that we train towards magnificence, so that when we fail towards mediocrity, we might still walk away victorious.

Sorry to derail the thread!
 
TSiWRX,

No problem, really enjoyed the feedback and insight.

The purpose of me starting a thread about the battery life of the Hex Wasp was in general to warn about making sure your firearm is ready to go and in tip-top shape should you ever need to use it

Advice about what distance an attacker is and how fast they can close that distance and how to consider those parameters versus optimal distances to Zero a red dot at and what level of proficiency you need to shoot at those distances, all adds to the readiness of your weapon and the shooter itself.

So your comments are more than welcome.

My local range is about to take last shooter now, so will try to get to the range tomorrow and dial in the Optic again but at 25 yards.

I guess I've alway been intimidated or to embarrassed to try and shoot targets at 25 yards or even 10 yards.

Mind you, back when I was in the Army and even pretty much now, with an M-16 or my AR I can punch half dollar sized holes at a 25 meter target, the ones that simulate hitting something at 300 meters.

But when I finally bought my first handgun back in early 2020, it was a rude awakening for me to find out just how much harder it was to shoot and how many more factors go into holding it steady and getting off good shots.

I was quite humiliated.

In the CCW course I took (so I could apply for my CCW license), they had us qualify at first 3 yards just to get us used to shooting, then at 7 yards to get at least 30 of 40 inside the 8 circle.

So, I've been thinking that 7 yards is a good measuring stick and the Standard.

I've read where other folks have posted that shooting a person at more than 7 yards starts looking more like homicide and less like self defense.
 
TSiWRX,

No problem, really enjoyed the feedback and insight.

The purpose of me starting a thread about the battery life of the Hex Wasp was in general to warn about making sure your firearm is ready to go and in tip-top shape should you ever need to use it

Advice about what distance an attacker is and how fast they can close that distance and how to consider those parameters versus optimal distances to Zero a red dot at and what level of proficiency you need to shoot at those distances, all adds to the readiness of your weapon and the shooter itself.

So your comments are more than welcome.

My local range is about to take last shooter now, so will try to get to the range tomorrow and dial in the Optic again but at 25 yards.

I guess I've alway been intimidated or to embarrassed to try and shoot targets at 25 yards or even 10 yards.

Mind you, back when I was in the Army and even pretty much now, with an M-16 or my AR I can punch half dollar sized holes at a 25 meter target, the ones that simulate hitting something at 300 meters.

But when I finally bought my first handgun back in early 2020, it was a rude awakening for me to find out just how much harder it was to shoot and how many more factors go into holding it steady and getting off good shots.

I was quite humiliated.

In the CCW course I took (so I could apply for my CCW license), they had us qualify at first 3 yards just to get us used to shooting, then at 7 yards to get at least 30 of 40 inside the 8 circle.

So, I've been thinking that 7 yards is a good measuring stick and the Standard.

I've read where other folks have posted that shooting a person at more than 7 yards starts looking more like homicide and less like self defense.


Understand that I am by no means suggesting you should shoot anyone at any distance, nor am I making a case for SD shootings that happen at 25 yards. Just because you would likely not fire at a threat from 25 yards with your CCW gun though that doesn't mean you should zero it at the most likely distance you would need to use it. It's pretty standard for handguns to be zero'ed at 25 yards. That is because from 0-25 yards your POI is going to be only minimally different, but if you are zero'ed at 5 yards and you should happen to need to take a 50 yard shot your POI is going to be significantly off. Really even at 25 yards it will be off by a good margin.

I was in a class a couple weeks ago and probably half the shots I took were between 5 and 10 yards. The other half were from 10-20 yards. Out of maybe 75 shots only 4 landed outside the 7 ring. And that was me moving forward, backward and laterally. I did not change my hold and that gun is sighted in for 25 yards.

I zero ARs ( even AR pistols) at 50 yards. From 0-50 the POI is very close to the same. Some guys do 36 yard zero, but I like 50/250.
 
Understand that I am by no means suggesting you should shoot anyone at any distance, nor am I making a case for SD shootings that happen at 25 yards. Just because you would likely not fire at a threat from 25 yards with your CCW gun though that doesn't mean you should zero it at the most likely distance you would need to use it. It's pretty standard for handguns to be zero'ed at 25 yards. That is because from 0-25 yards your POI is going to be only minimally different, but if you are zero'ed at 5 yards and you should happen to need to take a 50 yard shot your POI is going to be significantly off. Really even at 25 yards it will be off by a good margin.

I was in a class a couple weeks ago and probably half the shots I took were between 5 and 10 yards. The other half were from 10-20 yards. Out of maybe 75 shots only 4 landed outside the 7 ring. And that was me moving forward, backward and laterally. I did not change my hold and that gun is sighted in for 25 yards.

I zero ARs ( even AR pistols) at 50 yards. From 0-50 the POI is very close to the same. Some guys do 36 yard zero, but I like 50/250.
I probably need to find another range, albeit if I have to commute some distance.

The one near me is completely indoors and only a 25 yard range and you aren't allowed to do drills or even practice drawing from a holster.
 
I probably need to find another range, albeit if I have to commute some distance.

The one near me is completely indoors and only a 25 yard range and you aren't allowed to do drills or even practice drawing from a holster.
I prefer outdoors and I belong to a club about 8 miles from my house. I also have the luxury of being able to shoot in my back yard. I have a small 30 yard range set up.

In the meantime, 25 yards is good for sighting in your handguns and you can even zero ( ARs) at 50 with a red dot using the 10 yard method.
 
I prefer outdoors and I belong to a club about 8 miles from my house. I also have the luxury of being able to shoot in my back yard. I have a small 30 yard range set up.

In the meantime, 25 yards is good for sighting in your handguns and you can even zero ( ARs) at 50 with a red dot using the 10 yard method.
Funny you mention that.

For a while now I have been pestering my wife to sell the house and move out of the city and go find an old farm or piece of land out in the country.

When she asked me why I told her so I could set up my own firing range and not worry about driving to one and paying a $20 lane fee any more.

She just rolled her eyes and told me to go take out the trash.
 
Funny you mention that.

For a while now I have been pestering my wife to sell the house and move out of the city and go find an old farm or piece of land out in the country.

When she asked me why I told her so I could set up my own firing range and not worry about driving to one and paying a $20 lane fee any more.

She just rolled her eyes and told me to go take out the trash.


I pay $150 a year and have my run of about 10 ranges. Skeet, Trap, Rifle, Pistol, Training, etc.. 90% of the time I am the only one there. Also there are about 10-15 other outdoor ranges, most of which are on conservation ground and are free or maybe a $3 range fee for a couple of the nicer, more organized ones. I live about 40 miles outside of St. Louis. Have you looked around to see if there's any outdoor ranges nearby ? Worth a look.
 
Not really.

The only one within 25 miles is a private club and requires you to be a member of the NRA.
This NSSF site may help you in finding a shooting range:


NRA's another place to check. Scroll towards bottom of page:

 
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Not really.

The only one within 25 miles is a private club and requires you to be a member of the NRA.
My club is a private club that requires you to be an NRA member. I have been a life member since I was 18 years old.

In fact I am heading over there in a little while with my Jarhead buddy and his wife to do a little work. I got a .223 Wylde to break in, I'm going to shoot my mother's old Hi-Standard .22 9 shot revolver I inherited for the first time and since I have an abundance of .357 shells I'm going to plink steel with my GP-100.
 
I probably need to find another range, albeit if I have to commute some distance.

The one near me is completely indoors and only a 25 yard range and you aren't allowed to do drills or even practice drawing from a holster.
i belong to 3 ranges....

one is state owned, and free (outdoor)

one is a public range (indoor) with memberships if you want to join (which i paid up 3 years in advance)

one is 100% private. (indoor)

they ALL do not allow drawing from a holster. as far as drills, they only allow the police officers to do that, when they schedule time for them.

the private range requires a member to be an NRA member, i was told it helps reduce the insurance costs.

you gotta remember, not everyone even knows how to hold a gun, fire a gun, clean a gun, aim a gun.

safety is priority #1

and at my private gun club..??

EVERY NEW member...MUST pay for a class that is 6 hours long, so as it was said....EVERYONE is on the same page, and knows what everyone else is doing.

go to a public range like i do, and you wanna watch your 6 at all times.

RSO's, cannot be everywhere.
 
My range I belong to is a club, there’s a rifle range, 2 handgun ranges, small lake and camping area. It cost 100.00 the first year then 50.00 after that, I get mine free due to me being retired and been a member for over 25 years. It’s located out in the country, there are no range officers there, safety is on your own merit. It’s a nice place.
 
My range I belong to is a club, there’s a rifle range, 2 handgun ranges, small lake and camping area. It cost 100.00 the first year then 50.00 after that, I get mine free due to me being retired and been a member for over 25 years. It’s located out in the country, there are no range officers there, safety is on your own merit. It’s a nice place.
Does sound like a nice reasonable place.
 
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