Manufacturing defects

[KillerFord1977]

I read / watch all the reviews of the new SA 35 and internet comments.
I have to think about all the “wants” a person buys as well as extra dollars spent.

Lets face it. A pistol for most is a “want”. Lots of choices out there.

Lets digress to Automobiles.
Tons of choices.
The type car is a “want”.
Everyone could have a generic ride, yet we choose different options and some quite luxurious.

Like a pistol, it can kill , wound, injure if defective.

Yet folks buy auto’s all the time that have severe defects. Recalls are a norm. Folks shrug it off or sell. Then get a recall on another auto maker they own.

If sub standard performance was constant, folks wouldn't want the item. Yet we buy cars and pistols.

Teething in any manufactured product happens. It is how you resolve them.

Ferrari, Porsche, Boeing, Springfield. All get issues. Their mechanical
It happens.

It is not a constant for the SA 35, so give it a rest. It will sort out. SA 35 will work out in the end and so will Springfield Armory on their care for it

 

[Keystone19250]

I read / watch all the reviews of the new SA 35 and internet comments.
I have to think about all the “wants” a person buys as well as extra dollars spent.

Lets face it. A pistol for most is a “want”. Lots of choices out there.

Lets digress to Automobiles.
Tons of choices.
The type car is a “want”.
Everyone could have a generic ride, yet we choose different options and some quite luxurious.

Like a pistol, it can kill , wound, injure if defective.

Yet folks buy auto’s all the time that have severe defects. Recalls are a norm. Folks shrug it off or sell. Then get a recall on another auto maker they own.

If sub standard performance was constant, folks wouldn't want the item. Yet we buy cars and pistols.

Teething in any manufactured product happens. It is how you resolve them.

Ferrari, Porsche, Boeing, Springfield. All get issues. Their mechanical
It happens.

It is not a constant for the SA 35, so give it a rest. It will sort out. SA 35 will work out in the end and so will Springfield Armory on their care for it

Completely agree the thing that scares me is you including Boeing, when things happen to what they make planes fall out of the sky. I have no doubt Springfield will take care of any concerns with this gun.

 

[Sld1959]

After being a shop floor manufacturing specialist in data processing I saw juat how many challenges there are in new production lines and new components lines. This is why I wait a year or so with new products to let the manufacturing processes and parts supplies get worked out.

 

[Sld1959]

Its not how many issues a new product has, it is how the company handles them and makes changes accordingly. That is what matters and separates a good company from mediocre.

 

[Keystone19250]

After being a shop floor manufacturing specialist in data processing I saw juat how many challenges there are in new production lines and new components lines. This is why I wait a year or so with new products to let the manufacturing processes and parts supplies get worked out.

In manufacturing anything there is one thing you can count on is that something will go wrong daily. It’s how you react to it that matters.

 

[SimonRL]

Ferrari, Porsche, Boeing, Springfield. All get issues.

Wait a second, Ferrari and Porsche have issues? You’ve crossed the line now, my friend. Those are features, not issues. Your average Porsche and Ferrari owners are more than happy to pay for those features too. Remember when all those Ferraris were bursting into flames? That wasn’t an issue, it was an investment. One less of that model made everyone else’s worth more! Thank you very much!

 

[KillerFord1977]

Its not how many issues a new product has, it is how the company handles them and makes changes accordingly. That is what matters and separates a good company from mediocre.

Agree 100%

 

[Keystone19250]

Wait a second, Ferrari and Porsche have issues? You’ve crossed the line now, my friend. Those are features, not issues. Your average Porsche and Ferrari owners are more than happy to pay for those features too. Remember when all those Ferraris were bursting into flames? That wasn’t an issue, it was an investment. One less of that model made everyone else’s worth more! Thank you very much!

That is truly a strange way at looking at value appreciation.

 

[KillerFord1977]

That is truly a strange way at looking at value appreciation.

Right !!

Kill off the cars to increase your value.

Simon prob has a nice mafia job

 

[Annihilator]

I read / watch all the reviews of the new SA 35 and internet comments.
I have to think about all the “wants” a person buys as well as extra dollars spent.

Lets face it. A pistol for most is a “want”. Lots of choices out there.

Lets digress to Automobiles.
Tons of choices.
The type car is a “want”.
Everyone could have a generic ride, yet we choose different options and some quite luxurious.

Like a pistol, it can kill , wound, injure if defective.

Yet folks buy auto’s all the time that have severe defects. Recalls are a norm. Folks shrug it off or sell. Then get a recall on another auto maker they own.

If sub standard performance was constant, folks wouldn't want the item. Yet we buy cars and pistols.

Teething in any manufactured product happens. It is how you resolve them.

Ferrari, Porsche, Boeing, Springfield. All get issues. Their mechanical
It happens.

It is not a constant for the SA 35, so give it a rest. It will sort out. SA 35 will work out in the end and so will Springfield Armory on their care for it

If you want a gun perfection……need I say more……

 

[KillerFord1977]

Only Glock perfection I have come across ..
rest have a slight degree of cant that turn perfection to impressive

 

[TidalWave]

If you want a gun perfection……need I say more……
View attachment 22794

Gag.
Need I say more ?!?

( gotcha, Anni ! )

 

[TidalWave]

I read / watch all the reviews of the new SA 35 and internet comments.
I have to think about all the “wants” a person buys as well as extra dollars spent.

Lets face it. A pistol for most is a “want”. Lots of choices out there.

Lets digress to Automobiles.
Tons of choices.
The type car is a “want”.
Everyone could have a generic ride, yet we choose different options and some quite luxurious.

Like a pistol, it can kill , wound, injure if defective.

Yet folks buy auto’s all the time that have severe defects. Recalls are a norm. Folks shrug it off or sell. Then get a recall on another auto maker they own.

If sub standard performance was constant, folks wouldn't want the item. Yet we buy cars and pistols.

Teething in any manufactured product happens. It is how you resolve them.

Ferrari, Porsche, Boeing, Springfield. All get issues. Their mechanical
It happens.

It is not a constant for the SA 35, so give it a rest. It will sort out. SA 35 will work out in the end and so will Springfield Armory on their care for it

I see what your saying Killer, and agree with a whole lot of it (I agree with most all of what you’ve written in the time I’ve been here, far as that goes)..
But I can’t help but mention there’s an inherent difference in complexity in cars vs pistols, both the product and the manufacturing that leads to the product. Making a basic pistol is closer to making screwdrivers than to making cars.

Design wise? SA35 is essentially the BHP. And its longevity and track record ain’t all that far off the venerable ol’ 1911 (upon which it is largely based). Factories in countries that couldn’t mix mortar used to make Hi Powers, and they worked.
But I’ll grant you, Spgfld will get any issues sorted out. Just a bit surprising to me, is all..

 

[KillerFord1977]

I see what your saying Killer, and agree with a whole lot of it (I agree with most all of what you’ve written in the time I’ve been here, far as that goes)..
But I can’t help but mention there’s an inherent difference in complexity in cars vs pistols, both the product and the manufacturing that leads to the product. Making a basic pistol is closer to making screwdrivers than to making cars.

Design wise? SA35 is essentially the BHP. And its longevity and track record ain’t all that far off the venerable ol’ 1911 (upon which it is largely based). Factories in countries that couldn’t mix mortar used to make Hi Powers, and they worked.
But I’ll grant you, Spgfld will get any issues sorted out. Just a bit surprising to me, is all..

Sure, agreed, but new tooling and manufacturing of the line is new to SA.

Side note: Tool and Die makers is a lost art.

Maybe the trades across the realms such as aircraft, firearms and autos have lost the skill set and expertise of pure hands on manu processes / Tool&Die to the decades to computers .

 

[SimonRL]

I actually think that the very act of “remaking” the BHP was opening the door to this sort of issue. It was tempting the fates. In reality, I hear a lot of talk about much of the SA-35 being manufactured abroad and the gun being assembled in the US. I don’t know whether that is actually the case but it might account for initial quality issues.

 

[BobM]

Its not how many issues a new product has, it is how the company handles them and makes changes accordingly. That is what matters and separates a good company from mediocre.

 

[Talyn]

Design wise? SA35 is essentially the BHP. And its longevity and track record ain’t all that far off the venerable ol’ 1911 (upon which it is largely based).

I don't think so.

Besides that both have slides with firing pins and the frames hold the hammer, that's all the 1911 & BHP has in common. The only real thing they have in common is if the 1911 is chambered in 9mm. No parts cross-compatibility.

BHSS clearly said the BHP design is a hard one to get right and make it work, if someone is re-enginnering it.

 

[KillerFord1977]

I actually think that the very act of “remaking” the BHP was opening the door to this sort of issue. It was tempting the fates. In reality, I hear a lot of talk about much of the SA-35 being manufactured abroad and the gun being assembled in the US. I don’t know whether that is actually the case but it might account for initial quality issues.

Makes sense based on their pistol line from abroad.
Either way, new products have teething problems.

I expect issues in new items. Call me skeptic.
New mid engine Corvette, new SA pistol, new house build(how many times does rhe contractor come back), new Sig rifles.

Lets have a side bar list of a firearms makers that has NEVER had a quality and manufacturing issue

 

[Talyn]

There are manufacturing defects, and there are manufacturing mistakes. Two different issues.

 

[TidalWave]

I don't think so.

Besides that both have slides with firing pins and the frames hold the hammer, that's all the 1911 & BHP has in common. The only real thing they have in common is if the 1911 is chambered in 9mm. No parts cross-compatibility.

BHSS clearly said the BHP design is a hard one to get right and make it work, if someone is re-enginnering it.

You are correct T, now that I think about it…

I was falling back on something that I’d heard a long time ago and several times since: that Browning was somehow “fixing [improving? refining? whatever] some ‘flaws’ in his own original design concept”. Or some such… eliminate the barrel bushing, blah blah blah.
The finished product is indeed a diff pistol and Thanks for pointing that out.

The re-engineering of it is an intriguing point. Sounds like more than just refinements, and personally, that kinda reinforces my disinterest (for now, anyway), especially already having a Standard HP and an unfired Mk2 that I bought brand new…