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Winchester White box

Jsimon78

Jsimon78

Custom
Is it me or does Winchester seem a tad dirty and just doesn’t shoot like it should. I know I have gotten a tad picky about what I shoot (it goes back to the Glock G43X I had that was really picky then the M&P M2.0 10MM break in period).

I noticed yesterday shooting my last box of Winchester white box of .40 that the light on my G23.5 was all filthy and the residual from the gun powder was thick. Yes I clean my firearms after shooting (it’s also a way of inspecting it for fixes too).
 
Jsimon78 said:
Is it me or does Winchester seem a tad dirty and just doesn’t shoot like it should. I know I have gotten a tad picky about what I shoot (it goes back to the Glock G43X I had that was really picky then the M&P M2.0 10MM break in period).

I noticed yesterday shooting my last box of Winchester white box of .40 that the light on my G23.5 was all filthy and the residual from the gun powder was thick. Yes I clean my firearms after shooting (it’s also a way of inspecting it for fixes too).
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Never cared for this ammo, had to many issues over the years, but it is a little dirty, so is Blazer aluminum ammo
 
If Winchester (and others) don’t intentionally make some of their stuff “dirty”, how would they ever market and sell “WinClean” (or other brands’ variant) to the masses?

IMG_0720.jpeg
 
Jsimon78 said:
Is it me or does Winchester seem a tad dirty and just doesn’t shoot like it should. I know I have gotten a tad picky about what I shoot (it goes back to the Glock G43X I had that was really picky then the M&P M2.0 10MM break in period).

I noticed yesterday shooting my last box of Winchester white box of .40 that the light on my G23.5 was all filthy and the residual from the gun powder was thick. Yes I clean my firearms after shooting (it’s also a way of inspecting it for fixes too).
Click to expand...
i think its a combination of at least 2 things....the actual bullets used..are they coated all over with copper, or are the bottoms lead base exposed?

when i reloaded i used Bullseye, and then Titegroup....

both claim to be "smokeless"...

however, if i used all lead bullets, it was a smoke show.

once i went to fully poly coated and now fully copper coated....no more smoke.

so if WInchester is using semi-coated bullets, with the base exposing lead, you are gonna get a smoke show.

at least, this is what i have found.
 
Old_Me said:
i think its a combination of at least 2 things....the actual bullets used..are they coated all over with copper, or are the bottoms lead base exposed?

when i reloaded i used Bullseye, and then Titegroup....

both claim to be "smokeless"...

however, if i used all lead bullets, it was a smoke show.

once i went to fully poly coated and now fully copper coated....no more smoke.

so if WInchester is using semi-coated bullets, with the base exposing lead, you are gonna get a smoke show.

at least, this is what i have found.
Click to expand...
That would seem to be a valid argument. I shot 200 of these from my SW 432 at my local range this past week (indoor range). I just KNEW they were going to ask me to stop (or leave 😂) after the first few dozen. Almost like someone dropped a smoke grenade. Made it through all 200 though. 150 to go and won’t be buying anymore! And probably be 6 months + before I come close to getting the desire to finish off those 150 I still have.
IMG_0721.jpeg
 
Yes, an exposed lead base on a coated bullet causes more smoke than a fully coated bullet. The smoke comes from the burning of propellant gases coming into contact with the exposed, unlubricated lead at the bullet's base as it travels down the barrel, a phenomenon that is reduced or eliminated in fully coated projectiles.
Why exposed lead causes more smoke
  • Gases and lead:
    The smoke is not just from the powder; it's the result of the hot propellant gases coming into contact with the bare lead base of the bullet and burning any exposed lead.

  • Lubrication vs. coating:
    Traditional cast lead bullets often use a lube, but the exposed base is still a source of smoke, whereas a coating creates a barrier between the lead and the hot gas.

  • Coated bullet advantage:
    A fully coated bullet, where the base is also covered, prevents the gas from igniting the lead, which results in a "cleaner" shot with significantly less smoke.Other factors affecting smoke
    • Powder and load:
      The type of powder, specific load data, and how the cartridge is loaded can all impact smoke levels.
    • Bullet type:
      Different types of coatings and their application can also influence the amount of smoke produced.
 
Lab4Us said:
That would seem to be a valid argument. I shot 200 of these from my SW 432 at my local range this past week (indoor range). I just KNEW they were going to ask me to stop (or leave 😂) after the first few dozen. Almost like someone dropped a smoke grenade. Made it through all 200 though. 150 to go and won’t be buying anymore! And probably be 6 months + before I come close to getting the desire to finish off those 150 I still have.View attachment 96541
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what's funny is that me too...i took 2 boxes of my 45 ACP reloads, that had 100% exposed lead bullets.

those boxes are white, since they are reloads.

i shot off 50 rounds and a smoke show so thick, even i had to step back from the port, and the SRO asked "what are you shooting??", when another SRO saw the "white box", and assumed it was some branded ammo, and told him..."he's shooting white box".....


lol...
 
Old_Me said:
Yes, an exposed lead base on a coated bullet causes more smoke than a fully coated bullet. The smoke comes from the burning of propellant gases coming into contact with the exposed, unlubricated lead at the bullet's base as it travels down the barrel, a phenomenon that is reduced or eliminated in fully coated projectiles.
Why exposed lead causes more smoke
  • Gases and lead:
    The smoke is not just from the powder; it's the result of the hot propellant gases coming into contact with the bare lead base of the bullet and burning any exposed lead.

  • Lubrication vs. coating:
    Traditional cast lead bullets often use a lube, but the exposed base is still a source of smoke, whereas a coating creates a barrier between the lead and the hot gas.

  • Coated bullet advantage:
    A fully coated bullet, where the base is also covered, prevents the gas from igniting the lead, which results in a "cleaner" shot with significantly less smoke.Other factors affecting smoke
    • Powder and load:
      The type of powder, specific load data, and how the cartridge is loaded can all impact smoke levels.
    • Bullet type:
      Different types of coatings and their application can also influence the amount of smoke produced.
Click to expand...
And some powders just don’t burn clean to boot, leaving carbon behind..
 
Jsimon78 said:
I even noticed when that happens, there’s more jams right away. Yes there’s always something left behind but usually takes a little longer.
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Yup, but the dirtier the ammo, the quicker things get gunned up. Buddy bought some Chinese 7.62 x 39 that was THE poorest quality and dirtiest ammo I’ve ever seen. Run a mag though and it looked like your fired a case since cleaning.
 
Shibadog said:
Yup, but the dirtier the ammo, the quicker things get gunned up. Buddy bought some Chinese 7.62 x 39 that was THE poorest quality and dirtiest ammo I’ve ever seen. Run a mag though and it looked like your fired a case since cleaning.
Click to expand...

I don’t mind cleaning but some thing like that would just tick me off. As I always say “a clean firearm is a functional firearm when needed”.
 
Jsimon78 said:
Is it me or does Winchester seem a tad dirty and just doesn’t shoot like it should. I know I have gotten a tad picky about what I shoot (it goes back to the Glock G43X I had that was really picky then the M&P M2.0 10MM break in period).

I noticed yesterday shooting my last box of Winchester white box of .40 that the light on my G23.5 was all filthy and the residual from the gun powder was thick. Yes I clean my firearms after shooting (it’s also a way of inspecting it for fixes too).
Click to expand...
I had some WWB that wouldn’t even chamber.
 
We’ve had some issues with a few lots of the Covid era Winchester White box. At 25 yards, seated and bench rested with a suppressed Sig M-400 11.5, good trigger and Eotech it was printing groups the size of my hand. Got concerned bought a box of 55 grain Hornady Frontier and it went to the size of a dime. Had some other guys shoot the Winchester white box, same lot, same issues. Some of my guys shot different lot number and it was not as bad
 
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