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Would You Make This Deadly Gunfight Mistake?

Great article if you are a policeman or military and routinely go into places where you will get into a firefight. For those of us who are not police or military, the quickness of the draw and accuracy of fire are more important than speed of reloading. Also, we older non-police folk often carry revolvers. Yes, revolvers are slower to reload, but, according to the FBI study of several years ago, the average total number of shots fired in a gunfight was less than four. That is TOTAL shots fired.

Also, more important to non-police is Situational Awareness. If we pay attention to our surroundings, and get “that hinky feeling” we just don’t continue on the same path. “The gunfight avoided is the gunfight won.” (I think it is Masad Ayoob who said that.)

I often carry a snubbie revolver with a spare speed loader. I also carry a small semi auto with a spare six shot magazine. In many post-military years (I’m 67 years old) I have only had to put my hand on my handgun butt twice, never had to even draw it, simply because I was able to avoid putting myself in a not-good-situation.
 
I don't remember who it was but one of the "Name" trainers suggested not topping off your magazines at they range. He suggested shooting your magazine dry and reloading as needed during your course of fire. I started doing this in training and at the range and I became better at reloading.

I also had a security assignment out in the sticks where I was the only person on site for days on end.
FB_IMG_1631779835149.jpg

When I didn't have anything better to do I put a towel on the desk to catch the falling magazines and practiced reloads.
I did it for at least 20 minutes a day for 3 years. I've never bobbled a reload since I started doing that.

When I started at that site I worked nights. I had to walk the fence line every hour so I decided to put the time to use.

I practiced 4 point draws as I walked the fence. I never tried to do it fast, I did it by the numbers and I probably drew my gun 100 times every night.

I did the same thing when the company issued me a level 2 retention holster. I walked the fence line and did 4 point draws until I could do it in my sleep.

One I was walking the fence line and I spooked what I still think was an antelope. It ran right by me in the dark, cleared the fence, which why I don't think it was a human and took off.

That's when I realized I had drawn my gun without thinking about it.


I said all that to say that repetitive practice is the best way to learn a new skill
 
CaptVanO said:
Great article if you are a policeman or military and routinely go into places where you will get into a firefight. For those of us who are not police or military, the quickness of the draw and accuracy of fire are more important than speed of reloading. Also, we older non-police folk often carry revolvers. Yes, revolvers are slower to reload, but, according to the FBI study of several years ago, the average total number of shots fired in a gunfight was less than four. That is TOTAL shots fired.

Also, more important to non-police is Situational Awareness. If we pay attention to our surroundings, and get “that hinky feeling” we just don’t continue on the same path. “The gunfight avoided is the gunfight won.” (I think it is Masad Ayoob who said that.)

I often carry a snubbie revolver with a spare speed loader. I also carry a small semi auto with a spare six shot magazine. In many post-military years (I’m 67 years old) I have only had to put my hand on my handgun butt twice, never had to even draw it, simply because I was able to avoid putting myself in a not-good-situation.
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I’m practicing reloads. Regardless of firearm.
Statistics are you wont use more than four or even get into a gunfight for that matter.

Well, what if you are one of the rare statistic few that gets into a gunfight ??
And needs to reload ??

You have car and homeowners insurance, correct ??
For the same reason: IF it ever happens, you’re covered. Just like a gunfight
 
The Night Rider said:
I don't remember who it was but one of the "Name" trainers suggested not topping off your magazines at they range. He suggested shooting your magazine dry and reloading as needed during your course of fire. I started doing this in training and at the range and I became better at reloading.

I also had a security assignment out in the sticks where I was the only person on site for days on end.
View attachment 53545
When I didn't have anything better to do I put a towel on the desk to catch the falling magazines and practiced reloads.
I did it for at least 20 minutes a day for 3 years. I've never bobbled a reload since I started doing that.

When I started at that site I worked nights. I had to walk the fence line every hour so I decided to put the time to use.

I practiced 4 point draws as I walked the fence. I never tried to do it fast, I did it by the numbers and I probably drew my gun 100 times every night.

I did the same thing when the company issued me a level 2 retention holster. I walked the fence line and did 4 point draws until I could do it in my sleep.

One I was walking the fence line and I spooked what I still think was an antelope. It ran right by me in the dark, cleared the fence, which why I don't think it was a human and took off.

That's when I realized I had drawn my gun without thinking about it.


I said all that to say that repetitive practice is the best way to learn a new skill
Click to expand...

Great idea for home practice.
 
The Night Rider said:
I don't remember who it was but one of the "Name" trainers suggested not topping off your magazines at they range. He suggested shooting your magazine dry and reloading as needed during your course of fire. I started doing this in training and at the range and I became better at reloading.

I also had a security assignment out in the sticks where I was the only person on site for days on end.
View attachment 53545
When I didn't have anything better to do I put a towel on the desk to catch the falling magazines and practiced reloads.
I did it for at least 20 minutes a day for 3 years. I've never bobbled a reload since I started doing that.

When I started at that site I worked nights. I had to walk the fence line every hour so I decided to put the time to use.

I practiced 4 point draws as I walked the fence. I never tried to do it fast, I did it by the numbers and I probably drew my gun 100 times every night.

I did the same thing when the company issued me a level 2 retention holster. I walked the fence line and did 4 point draws until I could do it in my sleep.

One I was walking the fence line and I spooked what I still think was an antelope. It ran right by me in the dark, cleared the fence, which why I don't think it was a human and took off.

That's when I realized I had drawn my gun without thinking about it.


I said all that to say that repetitive practice is the best way to learn a new skill
Click to expand...
😁
 
CaptVanO said:
Great article if you are a policeman or military and routinely go into places where you will get into a firefight. For those of us who are not police or military, the quickness of the draw and accuracy of fire are more important than speed of reloading. Also, we older non-police folk often carry revolvers. Yes, revolvers are slower to reload, but, according to the FBI study of several years ago, the average total number of shots fired in a gunfight was less than four. That is TOTAL shots fired.

Also, more important to non-police is Situational Awareness. If we pay attention to our surroundings, and get “that hinky feeling” we just don’t continue on the same path. “The gunfight avoided is the gunfight won.” (I think it is Masad Ayoob who said that.)

I often carry a snubbie revolver with a spare speed loader. I also carry a small semi auto with a spare six shot magazine. In many post-military years (I’m 67 years old) I have only had to put my hand on my handgun butt twice, never had to even draw it, simply because I was able to avoid putting myself in a not-good-situation.
Click to expand...
I’m with you. If a civilian finds themselves in a situation where a high cap magazine won’t solve the problem I’m thinking they’re in a war😳. There are all these “tacticool” folks who seem to think they’re going to have to deal with a dozen well armed zombies, and while anything is “possible” the odds of any civilian encountering that situation are pretty slim. I’m unaware of ANY documented self defense situation where 15, 20, 30 rounds was needed. 😚. I know I’m old, and at the risk of offending some youngker’s out there but I tend to think Cooper was right “if you can’t stop a goblin or two with 7 rounds you don’t need more ammo, you need to learn to shoot”. YMMV😊 For what it’s worth, I either pocket carry a 938 Sig or J frame Smith OR belt carry an EMP each and every day. I’ve had one or the other handy daily for legal CC for nearly 4 decades-too old the change now😏
 
Shibadog said:
I’m with you. If a civilian finds themselves in a situation where a high cap magazine won’t solve the problem I’m thinking they’re in a war😳. There are all these “tacticool” folks who seem to think they’re going to have to deal with a dozen well armed zombies, and while anything is “possible” the odds of any civilian encountering that situation are pretty slim. I’m unaware of ANY documented self defense situation where 15, 20, 30 rounds was needed. 😚. I know I’m old, and at the risk of offending some youngker’s out there but I tend to think Cooper was right “if you can’t stop a goblin or two with 7 rounds you don’t need more ammo, you need to learn to shoot”. YMMV😊 For what it’s worth, I either pocket carry a 938 Sig or J frame Smith OR belt carry an EMP each and every day. I’ve had one or the other handy daily for legal CC for nearly 4 decades-too old the change now😏
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Mostly true, but the world is changing brother and being over prepared isn’t hurting anything.
 
Belt Fed said:
That ain't no lie and it's changing rather quickly too.
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roving ‘gangs’ or ‘packs’ of feral youngsters w/ no fear & looking to victimize for ‘fun’ whomever is unlucky enough to be near is why more than one mag can be helpful. Other than that awful scenario, I usually only have what’s my gun. Can’t carry more than 10 per mag.. legally anyways.

Good thing crooks are law abiding, rule following citizens that fear prosecution & jail time … wait, did I just become a Democrat or an ostrich making that illogical statement ?? Felt my IQ drop like a stone too
 
My understanding of the article is that the author is saying "If you're going to carry a gun, you should know how it operates, how to operate it and what to do when it stops operating. "

That doesn't sound unreasonable to me.

One of the things I've always been taught is if I'm ever in a gun fight the first thing I need to do once the shooting stops is reload my gun. There's your reload.

That doesn't sound unreasonable to me either.

Guns malfunction, One of the easiest ways I've ever been taught to reduce a malfunction is to simply change magazines.

Again, there's your reload.
 
The Night Rider said:
Which FBI study? Can you provide a link?
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CaptVanO said:
According to the FBI study of several years ago, the average total number of shots fired in a gunfight was less than four. That is TOTAL shots fired.

No I can't provide a link. You'll just have to take my word for it, or not. I did read the study most used and it, like much else the Gov. does was flawed. In the FBI calculations they included Cops committing suicide by gun. We can hope and assume that only one shot was fired. Also, where cops were shot from ambush, where the officer didn't return fire, zero rounds fired. Even the methodology of the "gun fight" was off kilter. I.E. Good guy and bad guy get into a shooting at the local stop and rob. They exchange 3 shots each in the store, run to the back ally and shoot 4 more, run out onto main street and the good guy finally double taps the bad guy ending the fight. The good guy shot 9 times, right? Not according to the FBI. That was three separate gun fights with an average of three shots each. o_O:rolleyes::
Bassbob said:
Mostly true, but the world is changing brother and being over prepared isn’t hurting anything.
Click to expand...

(y) Though I still carry my 638. It's what I'm used to, what I shoot and operate well, and comfortable with. Due to the changing world, I have considered switching to a recycled Tupperware bottom feeder, just haven't..... wait for it ...... pulled the trigger yet.:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
Really not that bleeping funny.
 
This is why I carry a reload.
www.washingtontimes.com

Illegal immigrants bring gang ties and violent crime to ‘sanctuary city’ New York

Authorities blame the surge in violence on so-called “asylum seekers” with connections to Latin American street gangs known for drug smuggling, human trafficking and murder.
www.washingtontimes.com www.washingtontimes.com

Its because illegal gangs of many people in a group are not just certain cities problems. They are everywhere now.
 
KillerFord1977 said:
This is why I carry a reload.
www.washingtontimes.com

Illegal immigrants bring gang ties and violent crime to ‘sanctuary city’ New York

Authorities blame the surge in violence on so-called “asylum seekers” with connections to Latin American street gangs known for drug smuggling, human trafficking and murder.
www.washingtontimes.com www.washingtontimes.com

Its because illegal gangs of many people in a group are not just certain cities problems. They are everywhere now.
Click to expand...
I carry a reload because it just makes sense. Even if the world wasn't upside down it would make sense. Things fail.

The SHTF stuff is not an EDC.
 
Bassbob said:
I carry a reload because it just makes sense. Even if the world wasn't upside down it would make sense. Things fail.

The SHTF stuff is not an EDC.
Click to expand...
I watched 7 hispanics pile out of a van last year and surround a car at a stop light .. a little road rage by the van. The victim then sped thru a red light at a huge intersection to get away.
I was across the instersection from them.

Agree. A spare mag(s) is always in order for me. Mags fail. Ammo fails.
Just SOP to have back up. Always has been.
 
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