In 50 years of reloading I Have used many different powders and settled on WW231 back in the 80s. Work up your own load to find what your pistol likes. You will find a combo that it loves-be patient. That turret press will do good work for you. I use a case gauge for the plunk test. Use lead that is at least 6% antimony it will reduce if not virtually eliminate leading and it will be hard to make a mark in it with your thumb nail (country boy hardness test). and I can't ever remember needing a bullet puller.
reloading questions/advice if you would please?
- Thread starter Old_Me
- Start date
Old_Me
Ronin
UPDATE: May 23, 2022
went to the range this morning, took all 16 of the reloaded .45 ACP's that i had.
(sadly, the RSO that i bought his reloading room from (including his Dillon 550c) , is on "summer" layoff, with all the other part time employee's, due to a slow down. the past 2 years, thanks to covid, everyone was working at the range, as beaches were closed as well as other gathering places people go to. but the range was busy each day. ) he was supporting my new venture, with his former press, and my Lee, and wanted to be kept in the loop.....
i also took my Tisas 1911.
i do not have pics, but i can admit that ALL 16 rounds went thru the barrel like they were meant to do.
of course, too, the Tisas has lousy sights, so i had at least 3 fliers. i gotta think about replacing those sights, but the front one is staked, so either watching YouTube videos, or a trip to a gunsmith.
otherwise, the powder was re-done at 4.0 grains, not 3.0, like i had read in the manual...then too, this is where i messed up. i was looking at 45 RIM, not 45 ACP...the guy at the bait and tackle store, where i buy my reloads from, caught that. he too has a Lyman book, 49th edition, to my 50th. i freely admit my foul up.
i was looking at avoiding 45 GAP, and just did not "see" that the 3.0 was for 45 RIM.
so, i pulled all 16 bullets, reset the powder charge to 4.0, and took all OAL measurements, and plunk tested EVERY cartridge.
this was all done on the Lee Pro-4000....and even though it is a turret press? i did each cartridge ONE at a time.
many of YOU had said that 3.0 grains was a low charge for a .45ACP, and i checked the book, but all i could see was the 3.0
went to the range this morning, took all 16 of the reloaded .45 ACP's that i had.
(sadly, the RSO that i bought his reloading room from (including his Dillon 550c) , is on "summer" layoff, with all the other part time employee's, due to a slow down. the past 2 years, thanks to covid, everyone was working at the range, as beaches were closed as well as other gathering places people go to. but the range was busy each day. ) he was supporting my new venture, with his former press, and my Lee, and wanted to be kept in the loop.....
i also took my Tisas 1911.
i do not have pics, but i can admit that ALL 16 rounds went thru the barrel like they were meant to do.
of course, too, the Tisas has lousy sights, so i had at least 3 fliers. i gotta think about replacing those sights, but the front one is staked, so either watching YouTube videos, or a trip to a gunsmith.
otherwise, the powder was re-done at 4.0 grains, not 3.0, like i had read in the manual...then too, this is where i messed up. i was looking at 45 RIM, not 45 ACP...the guy at the bait and tackle store, where i buy my reloads from, caught that. he too has a Lyman book, 49th edition, to my 50th. i freely admit my foul up.
i was looking at avoiding 45 GAP, and just did not "see" that the 3.0 was for 45 RIM.
so, i pulled all 16 bullets, reset the powder charge to 4.0, and took all OAL measurements, and plunk tested EVERY cartridge.
this was all done on the Lee Pro-4000....and even though it is a turret press? i did each cartridge ONE at a time.
many of YOU had said that 3.0 grains was a low charge for a .45ACP, and i checked the book, but all i could see was the 3.0
Pitdogg2
Professional
Honestly if you're going to reload I'd advice getting several of these in the calibers you're loading. Well worth the money, no guessing if that .001 sticking up is good or bad. If it doesn't fit or is not smooth across the top, pull it start over.
Dillon Case Gage (SS) -10 MM Auto 15162 | eBay
Dillon handgun case gages allow you to check your handgun ammunition to ensure it will fit a minimum sized chamber. Made of stainless steel for long life. The picture is for reference only, and it depicts a 45 ACP case gage.
www.ebay.com
Old_Me
Ronin
i have the Lyman gauge.Honestly if you're going to reload I'd advice getting several of these in the calibers you're loading. Well worth the money, no guessing if that .001 sticking up is good or bad. If it doesn't fit or is not smooth across the top, pull it start over.
Dillon Case Gage (SS) -10 MM Auto 15162 | eBay
Dillon handgun case gages allow you to check your handgun ammunition to ensure it will fit a minimum sized chamber. Made of stainless steel for long life. The picture is for reference only, and it depicts a 45 ACP case gage.www.ebay.com
pretty much the same thing, they sit into the recess, or stick up.
youngolddude
Professional
Some of my friends use a cylinder of their revolver for a case gauge. I have Dillon case gauges, but load them at the loading table at matches, spin the cylinder and if all is well, close the loading gate. I can't do that with autos, but do check the first few with a caliper for OAL as I do any load.
I once loaded .45 Colt at 1.60" and discovered they would lay at an angle in the carrier block on my 1873. I had to manipulate the carrier and lever for a round or two before the rest would chamber. Not very good for my stage times and unfortunately, I had loaded 1K of them. I suffered through them as they were too many to pull. Oddly enough, I've had issues with a .45 cal. lightning rifle (pump) with bullets loaded in the crimp groove. I recently lengthened the OAL to 1.60" and they feed like butter.
I once loaded .45 Colt at 1.60" and discovered they would lay at an angle in the carrier block on my 1873. I had to manipulate the carrier and lever for a round or two before the rest would chamber. Not very good for my stage times and unfortunately, I had loaded 1K of them. I suffered through them as they were too many to pull. Oddly enough, I've had issues with a .45 cal. lightning rifle (pump) with bullets loaded in the crimp groove. I recently lengthened the OAL to 1.60" and they feed like butter.
Old_Me
Ronin
yes, i have not bought anything as far as bullets for the 38 special that i have, but as i "pluck" test in a semi automatic, i'll be doing the same for my revolvers.
Glad the mistake wasn't the other way around. An inexpensive lesson but you must be very careful when reloading
Old_Me
Ronin
oh yes, i know. i figured as a first time reloader, i'd make a mistake or 2.
good thing, a couple of the guys here questioned why such a low charge.
glad too, that i stopped in at that bait/tackle store, and spoke with the salesman that also reloads, for himself, not for the retail end of the store.
i think the "worse" of a low charge would have been a "schnizzel, pffft" sound, rather than a "bang" like a 45 ACP should make....
Old_Me
Ronin
hey....!!Honestly if you're going to reload I'd advice getting several of these in the calibers you're loading. Well worth the money, no guessing if that .001 sticking up is good or bad. If it doesn't fit or is not smooth across the top, pull it start over.
Dillon Case Gage (SS) -10 MM Auto 15162 | eBay
Dillon handgun case gages allow you to check your handgun ammunition to ensure it will fit a minimum sized chamber. Made of stainless steel for long life. The picture is for reference only, and it depicts a 45 ACP case gage.www.ebay.com
i checked the Dillon shipping box, the RSO DID buy himself a Dillon size gauge, for 9MM, as 9mm was going to be his reloading plan.
youngolddude
Professional
I think your underpowered rounds would have exited the barrel, but let's not see what would happen, right? I know a guy who packed 5 rounds into a Ruger revolver barrel in a match. Luckily the gun was strong and didn't even bulge the barrel. When shooting quickly, the timer operator may not be able to stop the shooter from the first squib.
Old_Me
Ronin
well, when i was talking with the salesman at the bait/tackle store, he said there is "maybe" a possibility that the bullet could get stuck in the barrel.
maybe so..?? maybe not..??
but i was going to the range with that under charged ammo. luckily, that day fizzled out for me, since the town cops were there to practice or qualify that day.
but YOU and a couple of others here, got me to question that charge load, (of 3.0 grains) and i went to talk with my buddy at the store. then that's when it all made sense of what you guys were saying, but no one here mentioned the RIM 45 ammo....
as someone else mentioned earlier, better to be under charged than over charged.
i still VERY MUCH appreciate the help and advice here, i just need further information, so that i can do things right.
on another note, i now have the Lee manual coming in soon, and i was able to obtain a Hornady (11th edition) manual arriving tomorrow in fact.
youngolddude
Professional
I had never heard of RIM .45, so it didn't occur to me about that. Glad to hear your other press is coming and the other load manual. I am a proponent of having and referring to multiple manuals. One may not list loads that others do or they will just confirm loads you are looking at. There are spiral bound caliber specific manuals called "Load Books." I have several of these and refer to them besides my 2 Lee and multiple Lyman books. I also look online for Powder and Bullet manufacturers and what they suggest, but they are not my go to sources.
Old_Me
Ronin
other press..???
nope, just the Lee and now Hornady manuals......
the Speer (to me) was over priced at $100 + and unavailable right now.
i saw those spiral manuals, i thought they were generic, no name..???
but no other press then the Lee Pro-4000 and Dillon 550c that i already have
youngolddude
Professional
Whoops, I saw Lee and read as another press, not manual.
Load Books list powders from the major manufacturers and charges per bullet type and weight. They also list bullets from different manufacturers and loads from various powder companies. Each entire booklet is devoted to a specific caliber. I think I have .45 Colt, .380 acp, .38 Special among a few others. You do get redundancy, but you also get a few not found elsewhere.
There are differences in the Lee 1st and 2nd editions, why I don't know. The text of those is interesting, but the author is very opinionated and biased. I still find it worth reading for your general information so I overlook the pomposity. I do like the many loads listed which gives you options for both powder and bullet. I think I bought both for $10 and $12.
The Lyman was about $25-27. I have the 47th, 49th and their Cast Bullet ones.
Load Books list powders from the major manufacturers and charges per bullet type and weight. They also list bullets from different manufacturers and loads from various powder companies. Each entire booklet is devoted to a specific caliber. I think I have .45 Colt, .380 acp, .38 Special among a few others. You do get redundancy, but you also get a few not found elsewhere.
There are differences in the Lee 1st and 2nd editions, why I don't know. The text of those is interesting, but the author is very opinionated and biased. I still find it worth reading for your general information so I overlook the pomposity. I do like the many loads listed which gives you options for both powder and bullet. I think I bought both for $10 and $12.
The Lyman was about $25-27. I have the 47th, 49th and their Cast Bullet ones.
Old_Me
Ronin
thanks, i have the 50th
the newest one "might have" updated information, but right now, it's too close to editions to get basically a copy of the 50th.
Old_Me
Ronin
my new Hornady 11th edition ©2021, reloading manual just arrived. i went right to the .45 ACP, they show thier round nose lead bullet as discontinued, but the starter grain is 4.4 of the Bullseye powder.
which, when i reloaded by the Lyman book, they wanted 4.0
what i did witness at least a couple of times too, when reloading to the 4.0 specs?
was that once in a while, the grains in the scale would read 4.1, 4.2...now it could have been some slight vibration on the table, or could it have been a grain or two still in the measuring cup after i dumped out the last weight check..??
but at least by seeing the 4.4 in the Hornady book, i was still with in specs of the starter charge...??
is some ever so "slight" variation in the grain allowed..??
yes........no....?????
the Lee book arrives later this week.
thanks in advance
which, when i reloaded by the Lyman book, they wanted 4.0
what i did witness at least a couple of times too, when reloading to the 4.0 specs?
was that once in a while, the grains in the scale would read 4.1, 4.2...now it could have been some slight vibration on the table, or could it have been a grain or two still in the measuring cup after i dumped out the last weight check..??
but at least by seeing the 4.4 in the Hornady book, i was still with in specs of the starter charge...??
is some ever so "slight" variation in the grain allowed..??
yes........no....?????
the Lee book arrives later this week.
thanks in advance
jumpinjoe
Hellcat
Off the top of my head I'd say that a variation of no more than 1-2 tenths is nothing to be concerned about .... especially when loading on the low end of the recipe. Some scales will show as little as a couple tenths of a grain difference in some powders between a rainy day and a really dry day.
Now usually I would not write something like that, but I'm doing so only because some powder manufacturers will outright say that since modern smokeless powder is typically scaled by volume in manufacturing, that minor weight variations are of minor significance. Some even have an advertised formula for computing just how much of an overweight/underweight charge is acceptable. Now I won't do the computations for you but I will give you the formula for you to work out. But I advise you be very, very careful in any calculations involving modern smokeless powders.
In Winchester's loading manual it states: Acceptable tolerance is plus or minus .025 gram per cubic centimeter. I'm no mathematician, nor will I portray one for anyone else, but take note the formula is based on cubic centimeter, that's a volumetric value and not a weight value. You'll have to do the conversion first, then the calculation.
In your case above being off by a tenth or two, the only thing you might see is a small difference in velocity. But being on the bottom end of the recipe, and especially since the variation doesn't approach even the next noted charge on the list, you should be fine. There is even a formula for calculating the velocity of one charge weight against another even when the second charge weight is not listed in your manual.
As an aside, some years ago I was loading only a very small amount compared to what I had loaded in years past, so some of my equipment would set up for months (or more) between uses and as a result I would sometimes get unexpected results. One of those results was I was when using the Lee Perfect powder measure. A little red hopper sitting on top of a black polymer drum and crank assembly with an adjustable thimble. Well, if I didn't use it regularly, it would sometimes throw a totally off the wall charge with no explanation. I finally figured out that the polymer was more susceptible to static than some of the more expensive measures that used aluminum and/or brass drums.
So to find a simple solution to the problem, I just started adjusting my preferred charge weight that required a slight thump with my finger at the upper and lower of the stroke of the handle. Once it was adjusted to react to that little thump, it would throw a perfect charge each time for the rest of the session. All it took to overcome that little bit of static was the little vibration caused by the thump.
But even then I was careful to weight check on my scale about every 5 or so loads through the first couple dozen. Then again, I've always been a stickler for verifying my charge weights by use of a really good scale/balance.
Read carefully, then read again extra carefully, then proceed. Check and double check for accuracy and consistency in your loads and you'll eventually get accuracy and consistency in your targets.
Now usually I would not write something like that, but I'm doing so only because some powder manufacturers will outright say that since modern smokeless powder is typically scaled by volume in manufacturing, that minor weight variations are of minor significance. Some even have an advertised formula for computing just how much of an overweight/underweight charge is acceptable. Now I won't do the computations for you but I will give you the formula for you to work out. But I advise you be very, very careful in any calculations involving modern smokeless powders.
In Winchester's loading manual it states: Acceptable tolerance is plus or minus .025 gram per cubic centimeter. I'm no mathematician, nor will I portray one for anyone else, but take note the formula is based on cubic centimeter, that's a volumetric value and not a weight value. You'll have to do the conversion first, then the calculation.
In your case above being off by a tenth or two, the only thing you might see is a small difference in velocity. But being on the bottom end of the recipe, and especially since the variation doesn't approach even the next noted charge on the list, you should be fine. There is even a formula for calculating the velocity of one charge weight against another even when the second charge weight is not listed in your manual.
As an aside, some years ago I was loading only a very small amount compared to what I had loaded in years past, so some of my equipment would set up for months (or more) between uses and as a result I would sometimes get unexpected results. One of those results was I was when using the Lee Perfect powder measure. A little red hopper sitting on top of a black polymer drum and crank assembly with an adjustable thimble. Well, if I didn't use it regularly, it would sometimes throw a totally off the wall charge with no explanation. I finally figured out that the polymer was more susceptible to static than some of the more expensive measures that used aluminum and/or brass drums.
So to find a simple solution to the problem, I just started adjusting my preferred charge weight that required a slight thump with my finger at the upper and lower of the stroke of the handle. Once it was adjusted to react to that little thump, it would throw a perfect charge each time for the rest of the session. All it took to overcome that little bit of static was the little vibration caused by the thump.
But even then I was careful to weight check on my scale about every 5 or so loads through the first couple dozen. Then again, I've always been a stickler for verifying my charge weights by use of a really good scale/balance.
Read carefully, then read again extra carefully, then proceed. Check and double check for accuracy and consistency in your loads and you'll eventually get accuracy and consistency in your targets.